Firewall Wizards mailing list archives
Re: The home user problem returns
From: Mason Schmitt <mason () schmitt ca>
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 15:21:18 -0700
Brian Loe wrote:
While I think that user ed is still a critical piece to the puzzle, I think that the way that we go about attempting to educate needs to change. That's what I was trying to get across in my last email. It takes one on one interaction with people.If Ed WANTS to learn, he'll learn. If Ed wants his porn, you're annoying him, go away.
That's completely true. No argument here at all.
Why has spam control become the responsibility of the ISP? Unless it's originating from your network - and you have specifically disallowed such usage on your network via contractual agreements between you and the customer - why do you care how much spam your customers get? Only as an add-on service should an ISP be involved.
Haven't you heard? Spam is a global problem. Many of the means of dealing with spam involve voluntary cooperation from as many people as possible to combat the problem. That cooperation entails such things as outbound port 25 blocks at ISPs. As for the recipient of the spam. Most ISPs now do a basic level of inbound spam filtration, just to ease the load on their mail servers, let alone appease angry customers. Most ISPs also offer a subscription anti-spam service to those that want it. If you don't want to subscribe to the anti-spam service, I assure you that there is still tons left over after the ISP's basic filtering- you'll get all the spam you handle.
I guess I'm still confused. What issues are you having because of your customer's lack of security? Loss of bandwidth? Attacks on your internal network? What, exactly, is the result of your customers being bad?
I'll give you some examples in a sec, but first, since we are tossing quotes around, here's one for you, "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure". I know that I have to do my part and hope that others do theirs. As a result the problem will diminish overall. Here's an example that's not related to Internet access and bandwidth. In North America (and starting to become a problem in most developed nations), smoking is becoming a huge problem. Smoking is known to be linked to many forms of cancer, birth defects, gum disease, many respiratory diseases, etc, etc. - it's a really long list. Some people consider smoking to be a personal choice, so lets run with that. My first argument pertains more to Canada and other countries that have public medical systems. When enough people choose to smoke, they are placing an unnecessary burden on the public medical system, thereby degrading it for everyone else. You may be one of those militant smokers that feels it is their right to smoke wherever they please. If you decide you want to smoke in public, you may be smoking next to someone that is an asthmatic. It's well known that second hand smoke is just as deadly, if not more so, than the smoke you pull through your filter - if you and other militant smokers get their way, non smokers are now suffering the same health problems that are common amongst smokers. Other people may be enjoying the fresh air or a good meal and you are denying them that. The effect can even be as simple as making someone else's clothes stink. No matter how you look at it, this is more than just your problem - you are involving other people that may not want to have anything to do with you. I promised I'd give you an example relating to your use of your Internet connection. Here's one really good example for you. Recently a bot found it's way onto a customer's computer. That bot setup shop and began to send spam... through our not-so-smart smarthost. The bot was also a worm and it started spewing like crazy trying to find more hosts - it found some on our network and would have found some out on the net if I hadn't put egress filters in place on our router a year or two ago. I got called into work outside normal hours to track down the bot, our support people had to call the customer to let them know and they also turned of the customer's modem until the infection was cleaned out. They then had to start calling other customers and doing the same. In the short time that the spam was flowing, our mail server managed to find it's way onto a couple blacklists. As a result, customers that didn't get the worm were still being affected because some of their email bounced due to other mail admins using the blacklists that we ended up on. This in turn generated support calls. I then kicked myself for not having implemented rate limiting and really basic spam filtering on our outbound smtp relay like I had planned to and set about working out how I was going to do that. It turns out that it not feasible with our current solution, so this week I'm working on building a new mail server that will allow me to do the egress filtering I need to do. All in all, the fact that there weren't more safe guards in place cost us time and money and affected a fair number of customers. It has also pulled me away from other important work and thus I get further behind. If that doesn't paint a clear enough picture of why you should not be able to have a wide open un-restricted pipe of your own, let me know and I'll give you some more examples. -- Mason _______________________________________________ firewall-wizards mailing list firewall-wizards () honor icsalabs com http://honor.icsalabs.com/mailman/listinfo/firewall-wizards
Current thread:
- RE: The home user problem returns, (continued)
- RE: The home user problem returns Brian Loe (Sep 13)
- Re: The home user problem returns Jim Seymour (Sep 13)
- RE: The home user problem returns R. DuFresne (Sep 13)
- Re: The home user problem returns Mason Schmitt (Sep 13)
- Re: The home user problem returns David Lang (Sep 14)
- Re: The home user problem returns mason (Sep 14)
- Re: The home user problem returns David Lang (Sep 14)
- RE: The home user problem returns Bill Royds (Sep 13)
- RE: The home user problem returns Hile . William (Sep 22)
- RE: The home user problem returns Jim Seymour (Sep 13)
- RE: The home user problem returns Brian Loe (Sep 13)
- Re: The home user problem returns R. DuFresne (Sep 13)
- Re: The home user problem returns Mason Schmitt (Sep 13)
- RE: The home user problem returns lordchariot (Sep 13)
- Re: The home user problem returns Mason Schmitt (Sep 13)
- RE: The home user problem returns Jim Seymour (Sep 13)
- RE: The home user problem returns hermit921 (Sep 13)
- RE: The home user problem returns Jim Seymour (Sep 13)