RE: University Degree or CISSP

["McKinley, Jackson" <Jackson.McKinley () team telstra com>]

 From personal experience Ive found it works both ways.  Sure having the
degree and cert will get you pas the first cut but then it really
starts.  So you impress the managers with your cert and degree's in what
ever field and you get your second interview.  Now what happens?

Well normally you meet the team leader and his "head" tech.  Most of the
time they wont be all that impressed with your papers and want you to
prove you have the ability to take what you have learnt in the class
room to the real world where you don't have access to everything and you
have the all important and biggest road block to troubleshooting... The
customer :P ahahha

Ive seen people that look REAL good on paper and one sticks out from
them all.. Hired as a lvl3 engineer in a SOC, then we all had to cover
him for 2 mths till we just gave up and it was plain to the manager and
he was asked to leave... He had it all, Masters, CCNP, MCSE, etc, etc...
What he didn't have was a clue about the real world..  Give him a fault
and he couldn't work it back, just didn't have the "Stuff" you get from
hands on experience.

What I guess I'm saying is that its not just about your bits of paper..
But its more about you.  Personally I have a couple and they are
normally so I can make it past the recruitment companies cutting.. Then
its all about my work experience, my thirst to learn more and what I
sell to employers as "My abilities to see things other people don't"  :P
Since this is what I do as a threat analyst..

Think about where you want to be doing in 5, 10, 15 years...  Find what
you need to do those jobs and start doing it,  always making sure you
are moving, moving sideways or forward never backwards..

Cheers 

Jack.

-----Original Message-----
From: tbost () valocity com [mailto:tbost () valocity com] 
Sent: Wednesday, 31 August 2005 10:11 AM
To: gillettdavid () fhda edu
Cc: soumyadipta_das () yahoo com; security-basics () securityfocus com
Subject: RE: University Degree or CISSP

I agree with you. Its about getting the interview AND getting the job.
After that, its all about performance. The degree and/or certifications
mean nothing after that.

Getting the job is marketing yourself. What can you offer or what have
you done that makes you stand out in the crowd ? Be different. Get a
degree AND the certifications. It doesn't have to be either/or.
More importantly though, let the employers know how passionate you are
about the field. Go to work extra early. Leave later. Buy books and
read,read, read outside the scope of getting a degree or certification.

 -T


>   CISSP is likely to be necessary to get to some of the places you 
> might want to go.  But you can't get it without experience, so it's 
> not a good answer to your question.
>
>   At this point, I'd say the degree is most critical.  There are too 
> many employers where the HR bureaucracy never heard of any of these 
> certifications -- all they know is that a great way to trim the 
> candidate pool is to chuck out any resume that doesn't include a 
> degree.  So without it, you risk never getting to the interviewer who 
> knows the field and the certs and can decide whether you can do the 
> job.
>
> David Gillett
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: soumyadipta_das () yahoo com [mailto:soumyadipta_das () yahoo com]
> > Sent: Sunday, August 28, 2005 2:30 AM
> > To: security-basics () securityfocus com
> > Subject: University Degree or CISSP
> >
> >
> > Is it better (in terms of technology and industry
> > acceptablity) to get a university degree on information security than

> > certifications such as ccna/ccsp, ceh (or security+) and cissp?
> >
> > Soum