Security Basics mailing list archives
RE: Re: chat logs
From: "Melissa Fischer" <Melissa.Fischer () NorthMemorial com>
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 12:41:36 -0500
Anthony, thank you for your response, obviously there are people monitoring this log who are not as computer literate as I and yourself. Not only is it allowed by law, it is done on a regular basis, I work in the Health Care industry which is heavily controlled by regulations as to what people can and cannot be viewing, and in my capacity of Database Administrator, I have the security rights to view anything about anyone, however, my employment responsibilities are different and I only view what is necessary for me to do my job. Employers not only can, they DO monitor your computers and day to day activities, including limiting the email you can and cannot "completely" delete. Thanks for speaking up. Melissa Fischer Database Administrator Data and System Engineering North Memorial Health Care 763/520-1533 melissa.fischer () northmemorial com
"Bundschuh, Anthony D" <ANTHONY.D.BUNDSCHUH () saic com> 5/17/2005 10:41:42 AM >>>
Hate to burst your bubble, but your boss is perfectly able and allowed by law to view your email and web browsing history. -----Original Message----- From: David [mailto:david () clicksee net] Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 8:22 PM To: 'Stephen Alford'; 'Melissa Fischer'; security-basics () securityfocus com Subject: RE: Re: chat logs I must disagree with this line from Ms. Fischer- 'if they are doing nothing wrong, then there is nothing to hide and have "private".' How would you respond if your boss wanted to read your email and monitor the web sites you went to and read your IM's under the same philosophy? I love my wife and she loves me and we trust each other greatly and yet she still doesn't want to poop if I'm in the bathroom even though there is nothing 'wrong' going on. :) i.e. even children deserve some privacy. Choosing their friends and having relationships with those friends is part of growing up and learning to socialize and keeping total control over that will stagnate that process. Balance is the key word here I think and monitoring communications considered private is going to far just as having a child carry an electronic listening device would be going too far. I agree with Mihai's sentiment. How about the parents explain to the kids what the security situation is and go through the emails and chat logs together? Maybe even show the kids how to run searches using scripts and teach them some computer stuff? An interesting dilemma as to how far to go with things. I think it's a bit different with K-12 kids though. With a kindergartener, yeah, the parents should probably just go ahead and search through their files unasked. With a 12 year old that could really touch off a fire-storm. "Dad, how could you just totally violate my privacy like that?" -----Original Message----- From: Stephen Alford [mailto:stephena () sbspros net] Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 3:05 AM To: 'Melissa Fischer'; security-basics () securityfocus com Subject: RE: Re: chat logs Melissa, Mihai, et al, I can see both sides, as a father of 3 teens and a sec pro. We all went thru our trials and tribulations as teens and I loved and related well with my parents. However, I certainly had moments I preferred keeping between me and my peers. I know there were experiences, real & virtual, that I didn't consider WRONG but still kept from my parents. Looking back on this with perspective, I can understand my kids need for privacy, and I also understand my parental need to ensure they are protected from inadvertently choosing BAD options. It is one of our greatest challenges to balance these needs appropriately. Thus, like any seasoned sec pro, make sure you assess the whole situation before applying your solution (and you DON'T NEED TO BE A PARENT TO FOLLOW THIS). My 2c worth. Stephen Alford, MCT, MCSE+Security, CCNA, CCDA, ASE Director, Partner Practices & Solutions, SBS Pros Email: stephena () sbspros net -----Original Message----- From: Melissa Fischer [mailto:Melissa.Fischer () NorthMemorial com] Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 8:50 AM To: security-basics () securityfocus com Subject: Fwd: Re: chat logs FYI Melissa Fischer Database Administrator Data and System Engineering North Memorial Health Care 763/520-1533 melissa.fischer () northmemorial com
Melissa Fischer 5/13/2005 10:49:39 AM >>>
I understand your concern, apparently you must not be a parent. I have raised 3 sons, 24, 20 and now an 8 year old. Teenagers talk to EACH OTHER, not to their parents. Our parents HAVE personally talked to their children, looking at files on their computers is not taking away their privacy, if they are doing nothing wrong, then there is nothing to hide and have "private". Melissa Fischer Database Administrator Data and System Engineering North Memorial Health Care 763/520-1533 melissa.fischer () northmemorial com
Mihai Amarandei <mihai () xmcopartners com> 5/13/2005 9:45:28 AM >>>
I'm glad too se everyone helping out to find the logs and giving advice on how to search those teen-agers web history. Just me(and this has nothing to do with security), but wouldn't it be better that each parent asked directly its children about such incidents instead of searching and digining through their logs and web history? I for one wouldn't like it that my parents knew all my browsing and chatting habbits, and I think this is the case for most of today's persons. Teens are as ,uch entitled to their privacy "apriori" as anyone else in my opinion. I know all I've said has not much to do with security (actually it has to do with privacy), but neither is searching for logs. I'm not trying to undermine the importance of the threat and the gravity of the situation, I just don't think such an intrusion of privacy would be a good answer. Mihai Blog: http://secinternship.blogspot.com Melissa Fischer wrote:
Our community, Waconia, Minnesota has recently been the victims of threats against our children and schools. http://www.startribune.com/stories/462/5399090.html The Emergency Response Task Force assigned to our case asked parents to go home and check their kids computers for any chats or emails with information. We are trying to find a document explaining where and what to look at to find any information. We would like to post this on our school main page www.waconia.k12.mn.us for a resource for parents to use on how to find any information. Can you tell me where to find this information? Thank you in advance, Melissa Fischer Database Administrator Data and System Engineering North Memorial Health Care 763/520-1533 melissa.fischer () northmemorial com
-- Mihai Amarandei-Stavila - Xmco Partners Consultant Sécurité / Test d'intrusion tel : 33 1 47 34 68 61 web : http://www.xmcopartners.com Villa Gabrielle 75015 PARIS
Current thread:
- RE: chat logs, (continued)
- RE: chat logs Keller, Tim (May 13)
- Re: chat logs Zaven (May 16)
- Re: chat logs Times Enemy (May 16)
- Re: chat logs Zaven (May 16)
- RE: chat logs aixroot (May 16)
- RE: Re: chat logs Beauford, Jason (May 17)
- Re: chat logs Dave Aronson (May 18)
- Re: chat logs Alexander Klimov (May 18)
- RE: chat logs Steve Bostedor (May 17)
- Re: chat logs Stian Øvrevåge (May 18)
- RE: Re: chat logs Joshua Berry (May 18)
- RE: Re: chat logs Melissa Fischer (May 18)
- Re: FW: Re: chat logs Jeff Smith (May 18)
- RE: Re: chat logs Stephen Alford (May 18)
- Re: chat logs John Blackley (May 18)
- RE: chat logs Chapman, Carol (May 18)
- RE: Re: chat logs Bundschuh, Anthony D (May 18)
- RE: chat logs Keller, Tim (May 13)