Full Disclosure mailing list archives
Re: VPN providers and any providers in general...
From: adam <adam () papsy net>
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2011 20:50:31 -0500
"That actually depends on the situation, contempt can be criminal. And frankly if you refuse a court order for information like that, the LE officers will just seize it by gunpoint legally, then arrest you." I'm curious as to what you think would cause contempt to be a criminal offense, especially in that example. Secondly, without the appropriate warrant - they couldn't legally take anything. If they disregarded that truth and did so anyway, they'd open themselves up to a pretty big lawsuit for violating that individual's civil rights as well as due process. Not to mention, anything found would likely end up being inadmissible because it was obtained illegally. On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 10:39 PM, Laurelai <laurelai () oneechan org> wrote:
On 10/4/2011 6:35 PM, adam wrote: "(Option 3 - the guy heads downtown on a contempt of court charge - happens so rarely that it's basically a hypothetical)." You do realize that (at least in the US) - contempt is *not* a criminal offense, don't you? On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 8:05 PM, <Valdis.Kletnieks () vt edu> wrote:On Tue, 04 Oct 2011 03:15:02 EDT, Jeffrey Walton said:On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 3:06 AM, Ferenc Kovacs <tyra3l () gmail com> wrote:> > As I mentioned before it is hard to expect that a VPN provider willrisk his company for your $11.52/month, and maybe they would try it for some lesser case, but what Lulsec did was grant, so I'm not surprised that they bent."Alleged"Yes. So? In most jurisdictions, "alledged" and "probable cause" is sufficient to get a court to sign off on a subpoena and/or warrants. "Dear Judge: On Aug 23, a hacker using the handle "JustFellOutOfTree" did violate Section N, Clause X.Y of the criminal code by hacking into BigStore.com. The connection was traced back to the provider VPNs-R-Us. We would like a court order requesting VPNs-R-Us to provide any and all information they may have regarding this user". That will usually do it (after bulked up to about 3 pages with legalese and dotting the t's and crossing the i's). The next morning, the manager at VPNs-R-Us gets to his office, and finds two guys with guns and a signed piece of paper. At which point one of two things will happen: 1) the guy rolls and gives up all the info. 2) the guy calls his lawyer and makes sure that he gives up all the required info, and not one byte more. (Option 3 - the guy heads downtown on a contempt of court charge - happens so rarely that it's basically a hypothetical). _______________________________________________ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/_______________________________________________ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/ That actually depends on the situation, contempt can be criminal. And frankly if you refuse a court order for information like that, the LE officers will just seize it by gunpoint legally, then arrest you. _______________________________________________ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
_______________________________________________ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Current thread:
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general..., (continued)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... Christian Sciberras (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... xD 0x41 (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... xD 0x41 (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... doc mombasa (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... Laurelai (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... doc mombasa (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... Jeffrey Walton (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... Valdis . Kletnieks (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... adam (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... Laurelai (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... adam (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... Laurelai (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... xD 0x41 (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... Jeffrey Walton (Oct 06)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... Laurelai (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... adam (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... Valdis . Kletnieks (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... adam (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... xD 0x41 (Oct 04)
- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... adam (Oct 04)
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- Re: VPN providers and any providers in general... adam (Oct 04)