funsec mailing list archives
Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician?
From: Nick FitzGerald <nick () virus-l demon co uk>
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2007 12:37:28 +1200
Black Ops Security wrote:
maybe we should apply your logic to computer crime and spam ... and just start taking away everybody's keyboards until computer crime and spam decrease.
Or maybe we should apply Brian's (and your?) logic and give _everyone_ computers and watch computer crime and spam fall to zero? Stupid absolutist nonsense phrasings of the (assumed) other position (that you refuse to properly understand) are commonly known as "strawman" arguments and usually also useless engaging when the opposing side uses them as it takes an especially low intellect, or especially high disingenuity, to propose such arguments as if they are of any argumentative value... Brian actually does claim that increased gun ownership not only correlates with lower gun crime and/or death rates but is causally related, so it's not wrong or misleading to ask him, as Richard has, what level of gun ownership in the US will reduce gun crime to the level it is in the UK. However, no sane "pro gun ban" supporter would ever argue that blanket banning gun ownership will produce NIL gun crime, yet Brian and you (and many other morons) re-phrase the gun ban position as proposing that, or even more moronincally, criticize the pro gun ban position because places with gun bans don't have nil gun- crime rates. The debate is really about whether the equilibrium position under a gun ban (which takes quite some time to come about, particularly if such a ban were implemented in a region with historically high gun ownership) is likely to produce a more desirable (i.e., generally, "lower") rate of such crimes (and/or have other, gretaer societal benefits) than some other model (open slather, restricted ownership through strict licensing, required total gun ownership, etc). _Those_ are very difficult issues to tease out of the available evidence and folk of your and Brian's debating and research skills, and a forum such as this, seem very unlikely to begin to do a worthwhile job of approaching the answers to these issues... Regards, Nick FitzGerald _______________________________________________ Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list.
Current thread:
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician?, (continued)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? John Payne (Aug 29)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Brian Loe (Aug 29)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Brian Loe (Aug 29)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Alex Shipp (elist) (Aug 29)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Brian Loe (Aug 29)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? rms (Aug 28)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Dennis Henderson (Aug 28)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Drsolly (Aug 28)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Nick FitzGerald (Aug 28)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Brian Loe (Aug 29)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Brian Loe (Aug 28)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? disco jonny (Aug 28)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Brian Loe (Aug 29)
- Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Drsolly (Aug 28)
- Re: Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Nick FitzGerald (Aug 28)
- Re: Re: wow - is a "shadow" politician still a politician? Brian Loe (Aug 29)