Full Disclosure mailing list archives
Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal.
From: Jesse Valentin <jessevalentin () yahoo com>
Date: Mon, 11 Oct 2004 12:29:48 -0700 (PDT)
Hey Vince, With all due respect, while I find your argument interesting I think its a case of mental gymnastics. You mention that descrambling is copyright violation. According to the Merriam Webster dictionary the term Copyright is defined as: the EXCLUSIVE legal right to reproduce, publish, and sell the matter and form (as of a literary, musical, or artistic work). If we are talking about the exclusive right to sell cable television as a service, then anyone who violates this right would be committing ah what is that term, - piracy? The Merriam Webster dictionary goes on to define the word piracy as: an act of robbery on the high seas; also : an act resembling such robbery As we know robbery is . yes you guessed it stealing. Interesting how that term stealing keeps popping up, huh? J Jesse Vincent Archer <var () deny-all com> wrote: On Fri, Oct 08, 2004 at 11:41:49AM -0700, Jesse Valentin wrote:
How about using a digital de-scrambler for cable service? You?re getting something you?re not paying for? isn?t that stealing? True, its not a vital service, but isn?t this still plain ?ol stealing?
It's not stealing. The cable company has lost nothing. Every single bit it had, it still has. The only part you might remotely have stolen is the amount of electrical power required to bring the bits to your home. That's how, in ages now long gone, an acquaintance of mine got charged. It was the early days of X25 networking, you had plenty of computers unsecured connected to access points (login: root, password: root), so they created a BBS on one such. The BBS took off, until the company noticed. Unfortunately, they couldn't demonstrate any loss; the computer was still there, no data was damaged, the callers used charged calls (i.e. the company was not billed for X25 usage, the BBS callers were). In the end, the original BBS creators were charged with "theft of energy", i.e. raising the electrical consumption of the computer equipment due to extra activity. It didn't stick, but that was the only theft that occured, and there was no legislation on hacking to fall back on. It's the same with the MPAA and the RIAA screaming about "thieves". They've stopped doing so, it's trivial to show that nothing was stolen, and they are not facing lost property, they're facing lost customers. Descrambling is counterfeiting and copyright violation, but not thievery. (IANAL, of course) -- Vincent ARCHER varcher () denyall com Tel : +33 (0)1 40 07 47 14 Fax : +33 (0)1 40 07 47 27 Deny All - 5, rue Scribe - 75009 Paris - France www.denyall.com _______________________________________________ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today!
Current thread:
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal., (continued)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Jesse Valentin (Oct 08)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Harlan Carvey (Oct 08)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Anders Langworthy (Oct 08)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Jesse Valentin (Oct 08)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Vincent Archer (Oct 11)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Ron DuFresne (Oct 11)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Vincent Archer (Oct 12)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Stormwalker (Oct 12)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Vincent Archer (Oct 12)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Harlan Carvey (Oct 08)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Jesse Valentin (Oct 11)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Andrew Smith (Oct 08)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Alen Capalik (Oct 08)
- Re: Hacking into private files, my credit card purchases, personal correspondence or anything that is mine is trespassing and criminal. Mary Landesman (Oct 08)