Re: Why are paper LOAs still used?

[Ren Provo <ren.provo () gmail com>]

Most important parts on the LOA are the explicit ASN, the name to be found
in the cross-connect order portal and local contact data.  Contractors need
that.

Global networks rarely have a contact appropriate for provisioning in a
public facing database.

On Mon, Feb 26, 2024 at 14:50 Sean Donelan <sean () donelan com> wrote:

> Authentication by letterhead?
>
> Paper LOAs are unauthenticated documents, not worth the paper they are
> written on. Usually FAXed, which is even less authenticatable (is that a
> word?).
>
> Prosecutors are capable of using digital documents. Do it all the time
> with echecks, credit cards, ecommerce orders and ACH payments.  But LOAs
> are typically civil disputes, not criminal, when someone mistypes an IP
> address.
>
> They should verifiy the information in the paper LOA with a registry
> anyway.  Since LOAs have no intrinsic value, wouldn't be worth the
> prosecutors time.
>
> Usually a salesperson or order entry clerk thinks its required because
> they've always required it.  But no one in the legal department actually
> knows what to do with a LOA or how to authenticate them.
>
> Because carriers never authenticate LOAs.
>
>
> On Mon, 26 Feb 2024, Matt Erculiani wrote:
> > A paper LOA is a legally binding document, an IRR record is an IRR
> record.
> > Falsifying an LOA that is transmitted digitally is wire fraud and can
> > basically be handed right over to a DA for injunction and prosecution.
> >
> > Falsifying IRR records on the other hand leaves more work for the ISP's
> > lawyers to walk a judge (and jury) through the entire purpose and use of
> > that system, as opposed to "here's a super important sheet of paper that
> > they lied on case closed".
> >
> > -Matt
> >
> > On Mon, Feb 26, 2024 at 11:57 AM Seth Mattinen via NANOG <
> nanog () nanog org>
> > wrote:
> >       Why do companies still insist on, or deploy new systems that
> >       rely on
> >       paper LOA for IP and ASN resources? How can this be considered
> >       more
> >       trustworthy than RIR based IRR records?
> >
> >       And I'm not even talking about old companies, I have a situation
> >       right
> >       now where a VPS provider I'm using will no longer use IRR and
> >       only
> >       accepts new paper LOAs. In the year 2024. I don't understand how
> >       anyone
> >       can go backwards like that.
> >
> >       ~Seth
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Matt Erculiani