Re: power to the internet

[Ben Cannon <ben () 6by7 net>]

-48VDC is extremely reliable, we have also never had a power incursion on our DC plant. Any of them. 

I’m not sure I’d consider it cheap, but it’s not horrifying expensive and it *works* when you deploy enough of it in a 
2 or 3N fashion.

-Ben

> On Dec 28, 2019, at 9:04 AM, Baldur Norddahl <baldur.norddahl () gmail com> wrote:
>
> 
> What is wrong with lead acid battery backup? Seems to be exceedingly stable from my experience. We have all our 
> equipment on -48V DC and have never had a power interruption at any site.
>
> The requirements here are 48 hours of backup by law. Telecom is declared to be part of emergency and defense, so they 
> put in a requirement for resilience. 
>
> Regards 
>
> Baldur 
>
>
> tor. 26. dec. 2019 11.33 skrev Joe Maimon <jmaimon () jmaimon com>:
> > Unless telecom infrastructure has been diligently changing out the lead 
> > acid battery approach at all their remote terminals, powered gpon, hfc 
> > and antennae plants will never last more than minutes. If at all.
> >
> > A traditional car has between a 100-200amp alternator @12volts
> >
> > How much generating capacity can you get out of a typical hybrid?
> >
> > Self-isolating and re-tieing inverters. Economic household ATS systems. 
> > Do those exist?
> >
> > Enough independent distributed capacity and now comes the ability to 
> > create grid islands. How might that look?
> >
> > Electric grid shortage is likely coming to NYC, courtesy of folk of 
> > certain political persuasion and their love of stone age era living. IP 
> > decommissioning.
> >
> > If you have CO loop copper, keep it.
> >
> > Joe
> >
> > Don Gould wrote:
> > > This is a very short term problem.
> > >
> > > The market is going to fill with battery storage sooner rather than 
> > > later.
> > >
> > > Solar is just exploding.
> > >
> > > Your car will "house tie".
> > >
> > > 6G will solve your data problem.
> > >
> > > D
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -- 
> > > Don Gould
> > > 5 Cargill Place
> > > Richmond
> > > Christchurch, New Zealand
> > > Mobile/Telegram: + 64 21 114 0699
> > > www. <http://www.tusker.net.au/>bowenvale.co.nz
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -------- Original message --------
> > > From: Michael Thomas <mike () mtcc com>
> > > Date: 26/12/19 2:33 PM (GMT+12:00)
> > > To: nanog () nanog org
> > > Subject: power to the internet
> > >
> > >
> > > https://www.politico.com/news/2019/12/25/california-power-shutoffs-089678
> > >
> > >
> > > This article details some of the issues with California's "new reality"
> > > of planned blackouts. One of the big things that came to light with
> > > these blackouts is that our network infrastructure's resilience is
> > > pretty lacking. While I was (surprisingly to me) ok with my DSL
> > > connection out in the boonies, lots and lots of people with cable
> > > weren't so lucky. And I'm not sure how bad the situation is with
> > > cellular infrastructure, but I assume it's not much better than cable.
> > > And I wouldn't doubt that other DSL deployments go dark when power is
> > > down. I have no clue with fiber.
> > >
> > > So I guess what I'm wondering is what can we do about this? What should
> > > we do about this? These days IP access is not just convenience, it's the
> > > way we go about our lives, just like electricity itself. At base, it
> > > seems to me that network operators should be required to keep the lights
> > > on in blackouts just like POTS operators do now. If I have power to
> > > light my modem or charge in my phone, I should be able to get onto the
> > > net. That seems like table stakes.
> > >
> > > One of the things we learned also is that the blackouts seem to last
> > > between 2-3 days apiece. I happen to have a generator since I'm out in
> > > the boonies and our power gets cut regularly because of snow, but not
> > > everyone has that luxury. I kind of want to think that my router+modem
> > > use about 20 watts, so powering it up would take about 1.5kwh for 3
> > > days. a quick google look shows that I'd probably need to shell out $500
> > > or so for a battery of that capacity, and that's doesn't include your
> > > phones, laptops, tv's, etc power needs. What does that mean? That is a
> > > major expense for a lot of people.
> > >
> > > On the bright side, I hear that power generator companies stocks have
> > > gone through the roof.
> > >
> > > On the dark side, this is probably coming to a lot more states and
> > > countries due to climate change. Australia. Sigh.
> > >
> > > Mike