Re: Muni fiber: L1 or L2?

[Jay Ashworth <jra () baylink com>]

----- Original Message -----
> From: "Scott Helms" <khelms () zcorum com>

> > However, for any given ring, you are locked into a single technology
> > and you have to put active electronics out in the field.
>
> Correct, but you can have many layer 2 rings riding your physical ring. In
> a normal install you're going to have over a hundred fibers in your
> physical ring, I'd personally build it with over two hundred, but
> that's just me.

And I would personally not design something where the physical layout
locks you into a specific *category* of technology (active equipment
in the field), but that's just me.  :-)

> Here's the Graybar catalog with a good breakdown of the kinds of fiber
> you can choose from, though you have to have a rep to get pricing:
>
> http://www.graybar.com/documents/graybar-sps-osp.pdf

Nice reference, added to my list; thanks.

> > You can't, given a ring architecture, provide dark fiber leases.
>
> That's incorrect, you simply don't have as many available but in a current
> "normal" build you could easily provide 100+ dark fiber leases that extend
> from your MDF (still don't like using this term here) all the way down
> to the home or business.

And, conversely, I could, actually, *build a ring atop home run*; it would
just be a folded ring, where the active gear is at the end of each run.

> > I realize it is your argument that one doesn't need to do so,
> > there's no market for it, etc. However, I don't agree with you.
>
> No, my argument is that the demand for dark fiber is very low and so
> building your network so you can provide every single connection as
> dark fiber is wasteful.

Doing things which are not quite cost effective *yet* is pretty much
the *hallmark* of government, is it not?  Hybrid car tax breaks, Solar
PV install tax breaks... these things are all subsidies to the consumer
cost of a technology, so as to increase its uptake and push it onto the
consumer-cost S-curve; this is a government practice with at least a
century long history.

It's pretty much what I'm trying to accomplish here.  And thanks for
teasing that thought out of my head, so I can make sure it's in my 
internal sales pitch. :-)

> First, exactly how many and what Layer 2 technologies BESIDES Ethernet
> do you think you have a market for?

GPON/DOCSIS/RFoG?  That's one people are deploying today.

Over the 50 year proposed lifetime of the plant?  WTF knows.  That's 
exactly the point.

To paraphrase Tom Peters, you don't look like a trailbreaker by
*emulating what other trailbreakers have done*.

I'm not *trying* to do the last thing.

I'm trying to do the next thing.  Or maybe the one after that.

> First, there are very few businesses in the size town we've been discussing
> that even have this scenario as a wish list item. 

"...now."

>                                                       Second, how many
> businesses that need/want remote connectivity for their workers at home
> AREN'T running Ethernet on their corporate LAN and at the employees' home?

Course they are.

> Another thing to remember is that many businesses run VPNs because of the
> encryption and controls it provides, not because they can't get or afford
> direct connectivity. You have a vanishingly small set of potential
> customers IMO.

Perhaps.  But the *current* potential customer base does not merit 
locking in a limited design in a 50-year plant build.

> > Admittedly, this only works for the employees that live within range, but
> > it's an example of the kinds of services that nobody even imagines today
> > because we can't get good L1 services cheap yet.
>
> This is the key point. IF someone was able to put together a nationwide or
> even regional offering to allow inexpensive Layer 1 connectivity things
> would be different. 

How, Scott, would you expect that sort of thing might happen?

By people taking the first step?

Yeah; thought so.

My county doesn't have the same first-trencher advantage my city does...
but it does have the advantage that *it is nearly 100% built out as well*;
we are, I believe, the densest county *in the United States*; maybe 
Manhattan beats us.  Maybe DC; maybe Suffolk County in Mass.

So it's not at all impossible that we might be the first domino to fall;
there are a lot of barrier island communities near me that would be similarly
easy to fiber, since they're so one-dimensional.

(Geographically; I'm sure their residents are quite nice. :-)

>                      However, that's not going to happen AND we already
> have good cheap solutions to deal with that. Most commonly VPLS over GRE
> or VPN whose only real cost beyond the basic home Internet connection,
> is a ~$350 CPE that supports the protocol. 

You're paying $350 for VPN routers?

Could I be one of your vendors?

>                                           So, if you're running a company
> with regional or nationwide offices and home workers would you be attracted
> to a more limited method of connection that is only available in certain
> areas as opposed to the solution that works everywhere? Which is easier for
> your IT staff to support?

Accurate, but not germane.  They're not my target market.

Cheers,
-- jra
-- 
Jay R. Ashworth                  Baylink                       jra () baylink com
Designer                     The Things I Think                       RFC 2100
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