nanog mailing list archives
Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls.
From: Joel Jaeggli <joelja () bogus com>
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 2009 20:47:52 -0800
Owen DeLong wrote:
UPnP is a bad idea that (fortunately) doesn't apply to IPv6 anyway. You don't need UPnP if you'r not doing NAT.wishful thinking. you're likely to still have a staeful firewall and in the consumer space someone is likely to want to punch holes in it.Yes, SI will still be needed. However, UPnP is, at it's heart a way to allow arbitrary unauthenticated applications the power to amend your security policy to their will. Can you possibly explain any way in which such a thing is at all superior to no firewall at all?
I'm a consumer, I want to buy something, take it home, turn it on and have it work. I don't have an IT department. How the manufacturers solve that is their problem. As a consumer my preferences for a security posture to the extent that I have one are: don't hose me don't make my life any more complicated than necessary
I would argue that a firewall that can be reconfigured by any applet a user clicks on (whether they know it or not) is actually less useful than no firewall because it creates the illusion in the users mind that there is a firewall protecting them.
Stable outgoing connections for p2p apps, messaging, gaming platforms and foo website with java script based rpc mechanisms have similar properties. I don't sleep soundly at night becasuse the $49 buffalo router I bought off an endcap at frys uses iptables, I sleep soundly because I don't care.
Owen
Current thread:
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls., (continued)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Mark Newton (Dec 11)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Chris Adams (Dec 11)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Joe Greco (Dec 11)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Joel Jaeggli (Dec 13)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Michael Loftis (Dec 13)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Owen DeLong (Dec 14)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Owen DeLong (Dec 14)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. gordon b slater (Dec 14)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Chris Adams (Dec 14)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Mohacsi Janos (Dec 14)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Joel Jaeggli (Dec 14)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Steven Bellovin (Dec 14)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Joakim Aronius (Dec 15)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Mark Newton (Dec 15)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Joakim Aronius (Dec 16)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Owen DeLong (Dec 15)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Matthew Moyle-Croft (Dec 02)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Alexandru Petrescu (Dec 12)
- Re: Consumer Grade - IPV6 Enabled Router Firewalls. Mohacsi Janos (Dec 13)