Re: Encrypted files and the 5th amendment

[Mike Ingram <MICHAEL.P.INGRAM () saic com>]

How about making the passphrase keyed to location of objects in the room
where the machine is ?   The SWAT team or whatever they are called, will
usually trash the place looking for whatever and certainly will not put your
stuff back where it was...

"First letter of each book on the third shelf from the top, your Honor ....
But somebody threw it all on the floor, so I don't know WTF it is ! "

This is all a bit of BS anyways... They should just send it to the NSA.




On 7/12/11 3:48 PM, "Thor (Hammer of God)" <thor () hammerofgod com> wrote:

> Yeah, I'm sure there are ways to draw as little attention as possible, but I
> also agree with you that in the scope of the investigation, it's not going to
> take a genius to see that there is something wrong about available size...
> However, evidence by exclusion is not admissible.
>
> But again, the "I forgot" defense is very hard to prove against as well.  What
> we don't want is a path to where NOT providing unencrypted data is a crime in
> itself, because all that becomes is a method to ensure that you get prosecuted
> for *something* irrespective of what can be proved.
>
> I have a bad feeling about this stuff.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Tim [mailto:tim-security () sentinelchicken org]
> > Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2011 3:40 PM
> > To: Thor (Hammer of God)
> > Cc: full-disclosure () lists grok org uk
> > Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] Encrypted files and the 5th amendment
> >
> > > Actually, there is no way to tell if the there is another encrypted
> > > volume in existence or not.  One might stipulate that there "could" be
> > > if the filesize is obvious, but when you get into gig size files that
> > > are storing small amounts of data, that argument loses value.
> >
> > Well, yes, if you are trying to hide small amounts of data, then there are
> > many ways to do it with plausible deniability.  I thought you were talking
> > about booting entire separate OSes based on boot-time password.  Would
> > be hard to hide that amount of data without at least raising suspicion to a
> > determined investigator.
> >
> > Then again, many investigators are not determined.  Keep the partition small,
> > put it inside another encrypted partition, maybe they'll miss it.
> >
> > tim
>
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