RE: Cisco CTR

["Michael Marziani" <marziani () oasis com>]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rob Shein [mailto:shoten () starpower net]
>
> Yes, but nobody patches it THAT quickly.  CTR acts immediately, not a
> half-hour later...it would have started scanning by the time the hacker at
> the other end notices that he has a shell...

Please don't make unsubstantiated blanket statements like that.  Hackers are
skilled sysadmins and programmers who create packaged hacking tools that not
only search for and exploit flaws to get them onto a system, but also
install programs, disable security features, and yes, patch servers
*immediately* once they get inside.

A system like Cisco CTR might very well detect the attack before the
hacker's program has time to patch, but that all depends on how good the
hacker's program is, the state of the network, etc.  I'd like to see the
results of a live test of such an event.

If this type of attack can succeed as I think it could, I think a solution
would be for the IDS to keep a record of the patch levels of every system in
the network and allow those patch levels to be updated only through an
administrative interface (requiring additional authentication and of course
increasing the administrative workload).  Then the system wouldn't be fooled
by this technique.

-Michael

Michael Marziani
IT Consultant
Entercede Consulting, Inc.

> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Gary Flynn [mailto:flynngn () jmu edu]
> > Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2003 5:58 PM
> > To: Rob Shein
> > Cc: 'Liran Chen'; focus-ids () securityfocus com
> > Subject: Re: Cisco CTR
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Rob Shein wrote:
> >
> > > I think this largely relates to the earlier discussion
> > about how there
> > > is a difference between a "false positive" and an actual
> > attack that
> > > fails to succeed.  Ask yourself this: are you going to want to know
> > > about all attacks or just those that have a chance of success?  If
> > > someone throws IIS attacks at your apache web server, do
> > you want to
> > > know about it...or do you want to wait until they start using
> > > apache-compatible exploits?
> > >
> > > There's a good summary of what CTR does here:
> > > http://www.cisco.com/en/US/products/sw/secursw/ps5054/
> >
> > Another thing to think about - some folks have a habit of
> > patching the hole they came in through. Just because a
> > vulnerability scan shows no vulnerability it does not mean an
> > attack was unsuccessful.
> >
> > --
> > Gary Flynn
> > Security Engineer - Technical Services
> > James Madison University
> >
> > Please R.U.N.S.A.F.E.
> > http://www.jmu.edu/computing/runsafe
>
>
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