Full Disclosure mailing list archives
Re: Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls.
From: gadgeteer () elegantinnovations org
Date: Fri, 10 Sep 2004 12:28:05 -0600
On Fri, Sep 10, 2004 at 09:10:19AM +0200, Vincent Archer (varcher () denyall com) wrote:
On Thu, Sep 09, 2004 at 02:41:26PM -0600, gadgeteer () elegantinnovations org wrote:Given Moore's Law and the other rules of thumb regarding the progress of computer hardware it will be another 25 to 30 years before we match human capacity. Anyone who says they can achieve such in significantly less time is seeking funding. :-)Or is using the relatively simple reasoning that brains are full of cruft, overcapacity, and other elements that are not specifically required for sentience, but devoted to the management of a primate's body, and we can do a better job.
The trouble with simple reasoning, especially in the area of biology, is that it is often wrong. Evolution is a miser. Still the crux of the point above turns on what is considered a threshold for sentience. My handy Webster's defines it as: Sentient Sen"ti*ent, a. L. sentiens, -entis, p. pr. of sentire to discern or perceive by the senses. See Sense. Having a faculty, or faculties, of sensation and perception. Specif. (Physiol.), especially sensitive; as, the sentient extremities of nerves, which terminate in the various organs or tissues. "and preception" is the stumbling block here. Without it we have a device with a sensor that does or does not do something based on readings from said sensor. Big deal, there was such a device controlling the furnace of the house I was born in over four decades ago. With it... ah, now that is a different kettle of fish.
Emulating a human is very very different from making a sentience. That's the main flaw of the Turing's test: it attempts to prove the existence of human-type sentience, not sentience in general.
I think there is a conflation here of sentient entity and intelligent entity. The Turing test is looking for intelligence. During his day the only known model for intelligence was the self-image of human intelligence (which was (and still is) very poorly understood). -- Chief Gadgeteer Elegant Innovations _______________________________________________ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
Current thread:
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls., (continued)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. Peter Besenbruch (Sep 02)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. James Tucker (Sep 02)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. evol (Sep 02)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. James Tucker (Sep 02)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. Byron L. Sonne (Sep 07)
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- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. Byron L. Sonne (Sep 08)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. Michael Simpson (Sep 09)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. Andrew Farmer (Sep 09)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. gadgeteer (Sep 09)
- Re: Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. Vincent Archer (Sep 10)
- Re: Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. gadgeteer (Sep 10)
- Re: Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. Valdis . Kletnieks (Sep 10)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. evol (Sep 02)
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- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. Byron L. Sonne (Sep 08)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. Valdis . Kletnieks (Sep 09)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. Valdis . Kletnieks (Sep 02)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. Frank Knobbe (Sep 02)
- Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. Manohar G Singh (Sep 03)
- Re: Re: Empirical data surrounding guards and firewalls. James Tucker (Sep 03)