nanog mailing list archives
Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT]
From: Matt Palmer <mpalmer () hezmatt org>
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2014 22:21:04 +1100
On Wed, Oct 22, 2014 at 12:00:52PM +0100, Daniel Ankers wrote:
On 22 October 2014 11:34, <nanog () jack fr eu org> wrote:Before leaving Debian, things to think: - will systemd be officialy the only system available ? - if so, won't we get a way to bypass that ?And one other thought... is it really that bad? Personally I like it a lot better than sysV plus inittab plus daemontools.
When it was init+daemontools, I could hold my nose over the binary logging and consider using it. Now it's taking over cron and all manner of other things, there's no way in hell I'm letting it onto my systems. As to the issue of "will it only be systemd", the problem is that as the officially-blessed option, that's the one that'll get the universal support, so if you want to run something else, some things will mysteriously not work, and package maintainers won't care nearly as much. Bypassing systemd is a whole hell of a lot harder than switching out sysvinit for something else, because systemd does so many things, and many other things are being modified to absolutely depend on things that only systemd provides -- GNOME's the big one, but docker is closely tied to systemd too, I believe, I think udev needs systemd now (or has it been incorporated into systemd? I can't keep all this straight) and I'm pretty sure I've heard of other things deprecating non-systemd ways of doing things. The *really* damaging part of it, though, is that as systemd grows to overshadow the things it re-implements (udev, dbus, etc) it starves the alternatives of light and they quickly fall behind and are no longer viable as ways to avoid systemd. That isn't systemd's fault, per se, but it does make it much harder over time to avoid getting caught in the gaping maw. - Matt
Current thread:
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT], (continued)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Jay Ashworth (Oct 21)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Miles Fidelman (Oct 21)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Ricky Beam (Oct 21)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Jay Ashworth (Oct 21)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] George Herbert (Oct 21)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Miles Fidelman (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Tom Hill (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] nanog (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Elmar K. Bins (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Daniel Ankers (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Matt Palmer (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] nanog (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Barry Shein (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Valdis . Kletnieks (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Miles Fidelman (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Jay Ashworth (Oct 21)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Randy Bush (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Joe Greco (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Randy Bush (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Joe Greco (Oct 22)
- Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT] Jimmy Hess (Oct 22)
- Message not available
- Self destruction in open source systems (was Re: Linux: concerns over systemd [OT]) Larry Sheldon (Oct 22)