Re: Routers vs. PC's for routing - was list problems?

["Alexei Roudnev" <alex () relcom EU net>]

We had a lot of BSDI routers in past (in RELCOM, Russia); it was a good solution
but there was always reliability problem:

- you should use professional-grade PC which is not too chip (not brand name but
something having good power supply, good and reliable fans, and so on...)

- you should install everything on one PC and then _clone_ it to others. A good
idea is to have a custom CD disk with everything preconfigured and collected.

- moving parts such as disks is third problem. You should find some very reliable
disks, even if they are not too big. We had a problem - we started from 200Mb
disks, and when we began to think about replacement, we could not find anything
less than 800Mb.

Generally, PC based router cost much less than Cisco router, but need much more
skilled people to serve it. So, it can be reasonable for the countrieas when
people cost is less than in USA, and unreasonable for USA.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Granados" <scott () graphidelix net>
To: "Vinny Abello" <vinny () tellurian com>
Cc: <nanog () merit edu>
Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 11:22 AM
Subject: Re: Routers vs. PC's for routing - was list problems?


> Remember that a pc may have some certain functions that are "more
> powerful" than a router but a pc is a much more general computer.
> Routers are supposed to be and usually designed to do one thing only,
> route, not play quake, balance your check book, browse the net, etc etc.
>  So although for example a gsr-12000 may hhave a slower cpu than the
> machine on your desk it probably will route and pass more traffic than
> your pc ever will because of its design.  Not to say you can't route
> well with a linux or bsd system you can but at the high-end probably not
> as well.
>
> On Thu, 23 May 2002, Vinny Abello wrote:
>
> > I would have to say for any Linux/BSD platform to be a viable routing
> > solution, you have to eliminate all moving parts or as much as possible,
> > ie. no hard drives because hard drives will fail. Not much you can do about
> > the cooling fans in various parts of the machine though which routers also
> > tend to have. Solid state storage would be the way to go as far as what the
> > OS is installed on. You have to have something to imitate flash on the
> > common router. Otherwise, if you can get the functionality out of a PC, I
> > say go for it! The processing power of a modern PC is far beyond any router
> > I can think of. I suppose it would just be a matter of how efficient your
> > kernel, TCP/IP stack and routing daemon would be at that point. :)
> >
> > At 10:48 PM 5/22/2002, you wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, 22 May 2002, Andy Dills wrote:
> > >
> > > > > > From the number of personal replies I got about these topics, it seems
> > > > > like many people are interested in sharing information about how to do
> > > > > routing on a budget, or how to avoid getting shot in the foot with your
> > > > > Cisco box.
> > > >
> > > > Routing on a budget? Dude, you can buy a 7200 for $2 grand. Why bother
> > > > with a linux box? Heh, at least use FreeBSD :)
> > >
> > > Before the dot com implosion, they weren't nearly that inexpensive.  The
> > > average corporate user will also need smartnet (what's that on a 7200, a K
> > > or a few per year?) for support, warranty, and software updates.  Some
> > > people just don't appreciate being nickled and dimed by cisco and forced
> > > to either buy much more router than they need, or risk ending up with
> > > another cisco boat anchor router when the platform they chose can no
> > > longer do the job in the limited memory config supported.
> > >
> > > I have a consulting customer who, against my strong recommendation, bought
> > > a non-cisco router to multihome with.  It's PC based, runs Linux, and with
> > > the exception of the gated BGP issue that bit everyone running gated a few
> > > months ago, has worked just fine.  It's not as easy to work with in most
> > > cases, but there are some definite advantages, and some things that Linux
> > > actually makes easier.  They'd initially bought a 2621 when multihoming
> > > was just a thought, and by the time it was a reality, 64mb on a 2621
> > > couldn't handle full routes.  The C&W/PSI depeering (which did affect
> > > this customer, as they were single homed to C&W at the time and did
> > > regular business with networks single homed to PSI) was proof that without
> > > full routes, you're not really multihomed.
> > >
> > > --
> > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >  Jon Lewis *jlewis () lewis org*|  I route
> > >  System Administrator        |  therefore you are
> > >  Atlantic Net                |
> > > _________ http://www.lewis.org/~jlewis/pgp for PGP public key_________
> >
> >
> > Vinny Abello
> > Network Engineer
> > Server Management
> > vinny () tellurian com
> > (973)300-9211 x 125
> > (973)940-6125 (Direct)
> >
> > Tellurian Networks - The Ultimate Internet Connection
> > http://www.tellurian.com (888)TELLURIAN