Re: Brain Doping, or, The Futurological Congress

[David Farber <dave () farber net>]

________________________________________
From: Bob Frankston [bob37-2 () bobf frankston com]
Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2007 9:11 PM
To: David Farber; 'ip'
Cc: dave () wilson net
Subject: RE: [IP] Re:  Brain Doping, or, The Futurological Congress

I can’t help but sense a moral agenda. There’s no clear line between drugs to correct deficits and those that provide 
enhancement. There is an attempt to focus on the side-effects but these are not necessarily inevitable. Remember there 
often serious side-effects of not taking drugs.

What I find disturbing is comparing intellectual performance with sports. In sports the focus is on a game and a level 
playing field. If you have arthritis you can’t take a drug to enable you to perform at all. Tough break.

Why do we have the same attitude towards intellectual achievements? And why we do continue to see neurological and even 
behavioral issues differently than correcting physical ailments? What’s the difference between performance enhancing 
tutoring for the SAT and a drug that helps you focus during the exam?

We shouldn’t be at all casual about drugs whether the effect is on muscles or neurological functioning. But neither 
should we dismiss them because there must be something wrong with taking them. Is cosmetic surgery, with its attendant 
risks, immoral too?

What about other addictions like programming? The incremental rewards are very addictive … and when you stop you feel 
disempowered.




-----Original Message-----
From: David Farber [mailto:dave () farber net]
Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2007 17:05
To: ip
Subject: [IP] Re: Brain Doping, or, The Futurological Congress





________________________________________

From: Dave Wilson [dave () wilson net]

Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2007 9:41 AM

To: David Farber

Cc: ip

Subject: Re: [IP] Brain Doping, or, The Futurological Congress



Perhaps if people talked a bit more about the risks of messing around

with your wiring folks might be less inclined to engage in this sort of

behavior. While I certainly don't want to give anybody who needs

medication another reason to stop taking it, the permanent neurological

side effects of long-term use of drugs like prozac can be pretty

unsettling. Facial tics, for example, occur in about 25 percent of  such

users, and they can persist long after you stop taking the drug;

chemically induced Parkinsons is another known longterm side effect of

these selective serotonin reuptake inhibititors (SSRIs). In other words,

persistent, long term use of drugs that rewire your brain for purposes

other than survival -- that is, to combat profound depression, for

example -- can be extremely unwise and therefore such uses need to be

examined using risk analysis. Which is another way of saying you've got

to be nuts to try and goose your intellect every day of your career by

popping a pill; such behavior will inevitably profoundly shorten your

career and has a good chance of leaving you living the rest of  your

very long, medically extended, life tormented with profound neurological

difficulties.



-dave



David Farber wrote:

> ________________________________________

> From: Rod Van Meter [rdv () sfc wide ad jp]

> Sent: Tuesday, December 25, 2007 11:45 PM

> To: David Farber

> Subject: Brain Doping, or, The Futurological Congress

>

> Dave, for IP, if you wish...

>

> No one in their right mind, so to speak, would expect this *NOT* to

> happen.  As with many things, though, it seems to be happening quite

> suddenly.  I'm astonished at the assertion that three-quarters of

> classical musicians use them.  (Of course, it's not like the use of

> "performance-enhancing" drugs in music began with Keith Richards -- jazz

> was certainly an earlier form of "the devil's music".)  And at some

> colleges, a quarter of the students have tried ADHD-related drugs.

>

> We conduct such society-level experiments at our own peril, but this is

> hardly the first...

>

>                 --Rod

>

> http://www.latimes.com/news/science/la-sci-braindoping20dec20,0,5741092,full.story

>

> Drugs to build up that mental muscle

>

>

> Unlike the performance enhancers that plague athletic competitions,

> brain drugs haven't provoked similar outrage.

> Academics, musicians, even poker champs use pills to sharpen their

> minds, legally. Labs race to develop even more.

>

> By Karen Kaplan and Denise Gellene, Los Angeles Times Staff Writers

> December 20, 2007

>

> Forget sports doping. The next frontier is brain doping.

>

> <snip>

>

> Despite the potential side effects, academics, classical musicians,

> corporate executives, students and even professional poker players have

> embraced the drugs to clarify their minds, improve their concentration

> or control their emotions.

>

> <snip>

>

> In an article published today in the journal Nature, Morein-Zamir and

> University of Cambridge neuroscientist Barbara J. Sahakian say that

> clear guidelines are needed to decide what's fair. It may be reasonable

> to ban the drugs in competitive situations, such as taking the SAT. But

> in other cases, they wrote, people such as airport screeners,

> air-traffic controllers or combat soldiers might be encouraged to take

> them.

>

> <snip>

>

> "If there were drugs that actually made you smarter, good Lord, I have

> no doubt that their use would become epidemic," Yesalis said. "Just

> think what it would do to anybody's career in about any area. There are

> not too many occupations where it's really good to be dumb."

>

>

>

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