RE: Civil Disobedience

[Michael Gesner <dabion () WPI EDU>]

Responses Inline

> I meant victimless as in the comparison to murders, or terrorists. Hackers
> do *not*, repeat *do not* kill people. Terrorists do.

Terrorists kill people ?  Ideally, terrorism is meant to intimadate or
coerce a society into thinking in a different light.

eg: the terrorist attacks on the united states are meant to unsettle
americans.

Killing people is not necessary to threaten the safety of people.
Moreover, killing people commonly discredits the cause of the terrorist,
which in effect, nullifies what they are trying to get across.  (but
that's not the issue of this e-mail)

Simply put, to be a terrorist, you don't need to kill people.

> Yes, you have a valid point, privacy is something to be respected. Back to
> the point of the discussion - hackers/crackers/script kiddies/virii
> writers/worm writers *all the 'nasties' of the internet* are *not* killers.
> They do not belong in federal prison. Yes they are 'cyber criminals', and
> yes they do violate privacy.

Are killers the only people who belong in federal prison ?

Honestly, I fully agree that computer crime should not be considered on
the same level as other federal crimes.

The problem however, is that we are living in an age of information where
the information that we keep and use is currency.  Therefore, it is in the
interests of the country to insure this currency.

The problem I see, is that in attempting to establish these laws, the
community who is most affected by them whines instead of standing up to
explain why certain laws will not work.

> Not everyone brought in this world has the best intentions and wants to
> 'live and let live.' Thus we have criminals. In a perfect world we wouldn't
> need computer security because everyone would respect each others right to
> privacy. That just isn't the case - so if your a sysadmin, and you don't
> take the right steps to secure your computing enviroment, and you get owned,
> then well, either your in the wrong business or you should have done a
> better job. Thats how the world is.

Ouch.

I think that this is why communities such as this exist.  I'm not sure
that this community is as elitist as you make it sound.  Sure... system
administrators need a certain level of knowledge in the field.  But as we
say... "you need to start somewhere"

> I wish it wasn't like that - even so, i still can't justify sending a kid to
> federal prison (even if for a short lil' visit with mr. bubba)

*laughs* I certainly can't justify sending anyone to a short visit with
mr. bubba... that's just not right...

more to the point though... I feel like the system needs to be revamped.
Computer crime is a completely different beast.  You cannot handle
computer criminals in the same light that you handle other criminals.
Simply for the fact that their crime is in data and data alone.

Information/data is very vaguely defined, and is therefore very hard to
establish a set of rules for.  This is a philisophical debate that has
been going on in the Computer Science community for years.  I honestly
believe this resurgance will simply add fuel to the fire of a discussion
that will continue for years to come.

Just a few thoughts to stoke the fire,

Michael Gesner