Re: BGP Failover Question

[Owen DeLong <owen () delong com>]

On Feb 22, 2011, at 10:52 AM, Hammer wrote:

> I agree. But swapping providers is not the default answer in some environments. I work in an enterprise with multiple 
> GE circuits from multiple providers to the Internet. The lead time on calling up a different carrier and saying "I 
> need a gigabit connection to the Internet" would probably be 90-120 days. And then you get to go thru the 
> contracts/negotiations and MSAs. You don't just flip. In smaller operations I understand. But I was simply saying 
> that it's not always that easy. If I went to my boss and said one of our carriers sucks and we should dump them he 
> would just laugh and throw me out.
>  
That depends on where you are. If you have a router in one or more of the many "carrier hotels" around the world, you 
can usually order a new Gig-E cross-connect with service in less than a week. If you need to have a circuit engineered, 
then, 30-90 days is probably about right. If you need to have facilities installed to provide said circuit, it can be 
as much as 180 days.

However, I don't think the point was "disconnect them tomorrow". I think the point was "If the impact is that severe, 
the sooner you start the new provider process, the sooner you get relief."

> 1. What are the SLAs with the carrier in question? Do you have them clearly defined? Are they out of SLA? If so, what 
> compensation is entitled based on violation of said SLA?

99.99% of all SLAs are a pittance of money refunded IF you jump through extreme hoops to collect. They are rarely 
sufficient to resolve
or even compensate for outages.

>  
> 2. What trending are you doing to document the failures in SLA of the carrier in question? Do we have a documented 
> pattern of poor performence by using that trending?
>  
> 3. What are our contractual or legal options based on items 1 and 2?
>  
> 4. Don't forget about the Layer8 (political) factor. If your telco manager is buddies with the carrier then you have 
> to double your documentation against them. Some companies spend tens of millions a month on circuits. You better be 
> ready to justify yourself. 

Yeah, this is usually the biggest problem.

Owen

>  
>  
>  -Hammer-
>  
> "I was a normal American nerd."
> -Jack Herer
>  
>  
>
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 12:38 PM, Owen DeLong <owen () delong com> wrote:
> Assuming that he has provider independent space (why run full BGP feeds if you
> are not multihomed?), then, actually it's about on par and less disruptive in
> general. Add new provider, wait a  day or two, then disconnect old provider.
>
> If he's using provider assigned space, then, the big hurdle is switching to provider
> independent (requires a renumber), but, that's a good idea for a variety of reasons.
>
> I would hardly call the type and frequency of outages described a "whim" when
> using that as a reason to change providers. Sounds like he is suffering
> severe impact to his business.
>
> Owen
>
> On Feb 22, 2011, at 10:15 AM, Hammer wrote:
>
> > I'm not argueing that at all. But it wasn't relevent to the question at
> > hand. And depending on the scale of your business dumping providers is not
> > something done on a whim. It's not like your fed up with DSL and want to
> > convert to Cable.
> >
> >
> > -Hammer-
> >
> > "I was a normal American nerd."
> > -Jack Herer
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 12:11 PM, Bret Clark <bclark () spectraaccess com>wrote:
> >
> > > On 02/22/2011 12:23 PM, Hammer wrote:
> > >
> > > > As Max stated, you can set triggers based on thresholds that are monitered
> > > > via multiple methods in Cisco IOS. That way you could force the route down
> > > > dynamically. There's always a risk when letting the machines do the
> > > > thinking
> > > > but this would help in situations like this. Can't speak for other vendors
> > > > but I'm sure the features are similar.
> > > >
> > > > Well as someone else stated, if an upstream provider can't provide BGP
> > > reliably then it's time to give them the boot. Once in a year, okay, but
> > > beyond that, then it's time to read riot act with that provider.
> > > Bret