RE: "Engineer" (Was: Tech contact for Qwest?)

["Daniel Golding" <dgolding () cypresscom net>]

> What happens when a civil engineer refuses to certify a bridge is safe?
> What happens when a network engineer refuses to certify a network will
work?
> Why is there a difference, and what can we do about it?

I'm not sure that's the right question. Here's the real question: What
happens when a civil engineer certifies a bridge as safe, that isn't? He
goes to jail and his license is revoked. He's barred from the field.

What happens when a network engineer says a system will work that doesn't?
There are no civil or criminal penalties. The PE process is a two-way
street - you get the perks, but there are also consequences for misbehavior.

Daniel L. Golding
Sr. Internet Engineer
Cypress Communications
(and a degreed ME)


-----Original Message-----
From: owner-nanog () merit edu [mailto:owner-nanog () merit edu]On Behalf Of
Stephen Sprunk
Sent: Monday, August 23, 1999 12:25 PM
To: J.D. Falk
Cc: nanog () merit edu
Subject: Re: "Engineer" (Was: Tech contact for Qwest?)


I think that most of us act as ethically as management permits.  There's a
reason why vendors bring an "engineer" along on sales calls; customers have
a very solid understanding that nobody else (sales, marketing, etc) can be
trusted.  That's not to say every "engineer" is without ulterior motives,
but they're virtually guaranteed to be the most ethical people you'll meet
at any company.

What happens when a civil engineer refuses to certify a bridge is safe?
What happens when a network engineer refuses to certify a network will work?
Why is there a difference, and what can we do about it?

Stephen "Engineer" Sprunk


Stephen Sprunk, K5SSS, CCIE#3723
Network Consulting Engineer
Cisco NSA   Dallas, Texas, USA
e-mail:ssprunk () cisco com
Pager: +1 800 365-4578
Empowering the Internet Generation


----- Original Message -----
From: J.D. Falk
To: Vadim Antonov
Cc: david () brouda com ; nanog () merit edu
Sent: Monday, August 23, 1999 10:48
Subject: Re: "Engineer" (Was: Tech contact for Qwest?)



On 08/22/99, Vadim Antonov <avg () kotovnik com> wrote:

> David Brouda <david () brouda com> wrote:
>
> > Now, I have mentioned three key words: engineer, professional, and
ethics.
> > As a student of engineering, I believe that these three words go
> > hand-in-hand.
>
> The facts that somebody is being professional, educated and ethical does
not
> guarantee that he has any idea of what he is doing.  The catch is that a
> clueless person is generally unware that he's clueless, so he can be quite
> eithcal and professional in what he thinks he is doing. Watch the hordes
> of ATM zealots - many of them with very impressive credentials.  Does not
> make their "contribution" any more worthwhile.

Yeah, but at least they have a code of ethics.  Where'd ours
go?

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