Re: Will Amnesty International be taking up the case of DavidCarruthers of BetOnSports?

[Valdis.Kletnieks () vt edu]

On Fri, 21 Jul 2006 11:07:55 CDT, Brian Loe said:

> > given that we've already had Carnivore/Omnivore/whatever it is now, and
> > a president that has publicly said "I am the only authority as long as we
> > are in a never-to-be-ended war".  And even if it *starts* as "anti terrorism",
>
> So you also believe that he is going to suspend the Constitution and
> make himself a dictator?

First Amendment:

"Bush recently directed Attorney General Alberto Gonzales to use
"whatever means at your disposal" to wiretap, follow, harass and
investigate journalists who have published stories about the
administration's illegal use of warrantless wiretaps, use of faulty
intelligence and anything else he deems "detrimental to the war on
terror."

http://www.capitolhillblue.com/blog/2006/03/bush_declares_war_on_freedom_o.html

Fourth Amendment:

WASHINGTON, Dec. 17 - President Bush acknowledged on Saturday that he  
had ordered the National Security Agency to conduct an electronic  
eavesdropping program in the United States without first obtaining  
warrants, and said he would continue the highly classified program  
because it was "a vital tool in our war against the terrorists."

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/12/18/politics/18bush.html?ei=5094&en=5b0fa310edb6186f&hp=&ex=1134882000&partner=homepage&pagewante
 d=print

And a certain Jose Padilla and several hundred residents of Guantanamo Bay
would like to chat with you regarding this quaint concept called "Habeus
Corpus"...

And then there's some 750 "signing statements":

"...Among the laws Bush said he can ignore are military rules and  
regulations, affirmative-action provisions, requirements that  
Congress be told about immigration services problems, ''whistle- 
blower" protections for nuclear regulatory officials, and safeguards  
against political interference in federally funded research. ..."

  http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2006/04/30/bush_challenges_hundreds_of_laws/

But no, other than all that, he hasn't actually *done* anything that
resembles suspending the Constitution....

> Too late to fight that battle - you can't pretend to be outraged now
> when, after all, the Patriot Act just bundled everything everyone has

You're making the poor assumption that I wasn't equally outraged when
Patriot Act was being proposed.

> done or wanted to do to fight the war on drugs a long time ago. Do you
> think Clinton is a saint?

Then it should have been *cast* as "the war on drugs", so people could have
a reasonable discussion of whether the civil rights issues were justified.

> I don't recall the government selling that program at all - so who
> knows how they would market it, if they were marketing it.

CAPPS, CAPPS II, Total^H^H^H^Herrorist Information Awareness, and a number
of other related programs - you don't remember them trying to justify/sell
those to us?

> > I'd expect that you, as a "civil libertarian", would be among the first to
> > see that....
>
> While that does mostly describe my political beliefs, you have me
> confused with - I believe - Mathew who stated he was a civil
> libertarian.

My mistake - things got broken quoting on them, and I thought your reply was
part of Mathew's commentary..

>               I am curious as to why you chose to put quotation marks
> around that term though - do you not believe there are such things as
> "civil libertarians"?

I'd not have expected a civil libertarian to be an apologist for programs
that took away rights and liberties...

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