Re: @Stake CTO fired for Microsoft comments

[Adam Shostack <adam () homeport org>]

Just as a factual thing, Dan was not part of the l0pht.  Dan worked at
DEC, Open Market, some other places.  See
http://www.counterpane.com/board-geer.html

Adam

On Tue, Sep 30, 2003 at 09:15:08AM -0400, Frank Darden wrote:
|  
| Something tells me that @Stake goofed up big time on this one. I don't
| think he will have any problems finding new opportunities. And I agree,
| this does not bode well for @Stake's level of integrity. As an old time
| L0PHT fan, I for one feel that a chapter in history has closed. Watching
| Dan and co. Rise from perceived menaces (maybe somewhat earned) and
| growing up into a legitimate security service that business really need
| warmed the heart of every Entrepreneur and Security Geek out there. With
| the threat of losing ones job for exposing the truth, especially when
| tasked overall with security responsibilities as a career, is in my
| opinion abhorable. 
| 
| 
| Frank
| 
| 
| ============================================
| Frank Darden
| Mission Critical Systems
| 3320 NW 53rd St. Suite 202
| Fort Lauderdale, FL 33309
| (954)766-2550
| fdarden () locked com
| http://www.locked.com
| ============================================ 
| -----Original Message-----
| From: Mike Hoskins [mailto:mike () adept org] 
| Sent: Friday, September 26, 2003 7:11 PM
| To: firewall-wizards () honor icsalabs com
| Subject: Re: [fw-wiz] @Stake CTO fired for Microsoft comments
| 
| From: Paul Robertson <proberts () patriot net> On Fri, 26 Sep 2003, Joseph
| S D Yao wrote:
| >> Dan's never been afraid to tell the truth.  That @Stake fired him for
| 
| >> telling the truth, and such a well-known truth, says more about 
| >> @Stake's lack of integrity and love of MS $$$ than it does about Dan.
| >I don't know Dan, so I can't comment on that part.
| >@Stake is in some ways a competitor to TruSecure, so I'll try to avoid 
| >commenting on that part too.
| 
| you show wisdom beyond your years.  not that i know how old you are, but
| many would not have been so correct.  thanks.
| 
| > I think it's a damn shame that companies want the best of both worlds.
| 
| ditto.
| 
| > Much worse than knee jerk vendor reaction to criticism is knee jerk 
| > employer reaction to criticism of a third party.  I don't think I'd 
| > want to work in that sort of environment.
| 
| precisely!  and here's the thing (or at least one of them) -- the report
| clearly stated that the opinions were those of the individuals.  it did
| not say this was @stake's stance, or any other employer's.  the only
| place the employers were mentioned were in the individual's titles (and,
| i'm guessing, they may not have even decided on that).
| 
| the point is, people told the truth and even took precautions to make
| sure the truth was NOT misinterpreted as the opinion of their employers.
| yet, some employers overreacted, showing quite obviously who their bed
| partners truly are.
| 
| > Homogenous networks are bad, and it's worse when your protection
| 
| spot on, as usual.  but we're all just agreeing here.  people seemed to
| think having tiered firewalls back in the dot-bomb days was "just
| something you do when you have loads of VC cash" -- not.  it's just one
| example of taking network security as seriously as it deserves...  at
| least for (truly) mission critical sites.  blind vendor loyalty rarely
| pays in our world.  well, unless it's a check from M$.  ("a check from
| M$"
| is essentially what's been offered to numerous government agencies to
| maintain loyalty to M$ product lines.)
| 
| RFCs have said what Dan and his associates said in this report for
| years.
| M$ quietly ignored those reccomendations, made by some of the most
| upstanding members of the Internet community.  it comes as no surprise
| to me that M$ and the vendors they own are still doing the same today.
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-- 
"It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once."
                                                       -Hume


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