this list is turning into usless drivel

[tfs () vampire science gmu edu (Tim Scanlon)]

Man, I didn't think bugtraq could get any worse. -Silly me,
I shouldn't have presumed as much.

It actually took a turn for the worse. It's starting to look like
alt.irc, or alt.sex.stories, and with the quoted inclusion of
the stupid OLD sex chain letter, like alt.fan.warlord.

It USED to be about full disclosure. Not "partial disclosure,
with maybe a bit sooner heads up than CERT's year down the
road, but let's not talk substance." Which is what it seems
to have degenerated into, at _best_.

Someone asked me about the bugtraq list about 2 weeks ago.
Asked me if it was a good resource for finding and understanding
problems with systems. I asked them what did they mean by that,
they said, "Well I want to find out about problems a bit faster
than too late, and I want to understand what they are. I don't
like feeling like I'm at the mercy of vendors. I really don't
like not knowing what's going on on my systems."
(I'm not just making up a specious example, this did happen.)

I told them that the list used to be great, really good for
stuff like that. Then I said, "Unfortunately it's gone waaaay
down hill. I wouldn't reccomeend it anymore." & I made comments
that it had gotten to be more noise than signal.

        Unfortunately I think Scott Chasin kinda hit it. Aside
from total weaseling about disclosure, which is serious bullshit
in and of itself when it comes to helping admins, it's now
degenerating into ~just bullshit~.

I've got a suggestion. If you aren't willing to deal with full
disclosure get off the list. If you want to engage in discussion
that shies around problems, get off the list. Just leave. It IS
ok to disagree, and take it someplace else. And please! no more
crap posting, no more full bore quotes of crap postings, and no
more stupid arguments about the worth or full disclosure. This ain't
the place for it.

I unsubscribed to firewalls because I got enormously frustrated
with the s/n ratio there. I'm considering seriously doing the
same here. That alone, for me personally at least, says allot
about the direction the list has taken. -See I used to think it
was probably the most valuable list ~for my professional use~ that
I was on.

I'd like to see that situation reverse...

        Tim Scanlon