Re: [GSOC] ncat gui idea

[Shinnok <admin () shinnok com>]

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Hi Fyodor,

Thanks for writing your views on my proposals, they are valuable and
well regarded.

Embedded answers bellow for what I have to say in reply:

On 03/31/2011 04:44 AM, Fyodor wrote:
> On Sun, Mar 27, 2011 at 01:45:33PM +0300, Shinnok wrote:
> > I would like to probe my idea for this GSOC iteration
> > for nmap against the nmap-dev list. What I am thinking
> > about is a GUI for Ncat,
>
> That sounds like a clever and potentially valuable idea to me.  We
> would seriously consider such an application.
>
> > written in native C++ code and Qt.
>
> That part makes it a harder sell.  Nmap already ships with a GUI named
> Zenmap which is written with Python and PyGTK.  Remember that
> maintaining software is usually more work over the long term than the
> initial work of writing it, and using a consistent set of software
> infrastructure makes maintenance much easier.  It substantially eases
> the cross-platform build process and also reduces the number of
> software libraries and programming languages that maintainers must
> know.
Yes indeed, adding a new library dependency and the afferent support
along with the currently supported GTK makes it harder to adopt from the
current standpoint of the Nmap suite. I thought of this beforehand and
Toni hinted at that too. You, of all, know what's best for Nmap, of
course and I respect that and what's best for the project as a hole and
at the current time.
> So I wouldn't rule out SoC funding for a Qt GUI for Ncat, but it would
> be a very tough sell.  Of course you are welcome and encouraged to add
> Ncat support to your NetcatGUI on your own.  The need to reduce
> software dependencies only applies to packages we ship (e.g. with
> Nmap).  But the main goal of SoC for us is to help students produce
> code that can be integrated with Nmap and used by millions of people
> after just a few months of development.
I am definitely going to continue work on NetcatGUI, though now I am
seriously considering basing on Ncat, now that I have a plan and
everything set up in mind and writing.
> Remember that the hardest part of creating a great Ncat GUI is
> designing an efficient, intuitive, well-organized, and powerful
> interface.  Writing the code (whether in Qt or PyGTK) will likely take
> a minority of the time.
I am aware of that. Seriously. Even though, I know I would have done a
great job, at the same time I do realize that it's kind of risky from
your shoes to test that on a GSoC slot and basic business and economics
guide toward refusing such a *risky* proposal. Damn game theory. :-)
> > Another reason that i am sending this e-mail is to probe the nmap's
> > team and community need for a new GUI for nmap.
>
> Everyone prefers writing a new program from scratch, but (except when
> there is a pressing need requiring a rewrite), we (Nmap project and
> Nmap users) normally get the most value from spending the time
> improving the existing code rather than trying to reinvent the wheel
> from scratch.
>
> Writing a new Nmap GUI would be fun and you're certainly welcome and
> encouraged to do that on your own (including mailing test releases to
> nmap-dev, etc.)  But we probably wouldn't sponsor such a thing for
> SoC.  Again, we're mostly looking for code that stands a high chance
> of being integrated into Nmap.  Now if you started an Nmap Qt GUI and
> by next year it was competitive with Zenmap in terms of UI and
> features, we'd consider a SoC project to enhance it.  But don't
> underestimate how hard it would be to rewrite a GUI like Nmap.  We've
> had numerous SoC students spend the summer just implementing specific
> features for the existing Zenmap.
If i get around time, I will start working on a new UI in Qt for Nmap,
It sounds really tempting to me, to put in code and design, what I have
in mind as a frontend for Nmap. Though, as always, time drags and beats
you down to the ground reality. Will see. :D
> I hope this mail doesn't sound discouraging!  I'm just trying to guide
> you toward the ideas we're most likely to accept.  I'd encourage you
> to apply for Nmap SoC in any case.
It's not discouraging in any way, I applied before reading this e-mail
and I think my offer will be hard to refuse without second thoughts. :)
I really appreciate the feedback and your views as the Nmap master
cheerleader. Open Source is not Tango, it is such a great havoc of a
dance, but you feel so great after performing it. Hehe.
> Cheers,
> Fyodor

Thanks,

Shinnok
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