nanog mailing list archives
Re: best effort has economic problems
From: Gordon Cook <cook () cookreport com>
Date: Sat, 29 May 2004 16:53:17 -0400
may I make just a passing observation?From a technology point of view the best effort internet certainly "works." Not surprisingly the comments here are primarily debating the finer points of the technology.
The point I am making in my report is NOT that the best effort network has technology problems but rather that it has ECONOMIC PROBLEMS. That it might support 2 or 3 players not 2 or 3 HUNDRED. That until companies begin to go chapter seven and vanish, the best effort net will be a black hole that burns up capital because, for many players, the OPERATIONAL expense is more than they get for bandwidth never mind cap-ex.
best effort won't go away. many best effort players will.for the time being, best effort bandwidth prices as an absolute commodity cannot sustain networks over the long haul. A network that can deliver QoS the report hypothesizes may be able to attract enough revenue to become profitable. How to to this my group is still discussing. We don't pretend that QoS is easy or any kind of mature collection of technologies, but increasingly it looks as though the industry, if it is ever going to be self sustaining, really needs to look at QoS services and solutions.
On Sat, 29 May 2004, Edward B. Dreger wrote:Nitpicking: Latency isn't that important with unidirectional communication. However, VoIP users seem reasonably happy with current latency and jitter -- and the Internet still is _largely_ xxTP, anyway... particularly if one ignores peer-to-peer file- swapping programs.Latency is fine for VOIP as long as you dont interact with the PSTN network, if you want to interact with PSTN then you need echo cancellation if you have high latency on the IP part. Most VOIP applications can handle 40ms jitter, so that's normally no problem unless your local access is full. Packet loss is normally no problem for VOIP if you use a proper (non-telco developed) codec. VOIP is actually better off with high packet loss and low jitter than the other way around (throwing off the old truth that core equipment should have lots of buffers). -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike () swm pp se
-- ============================================================= The COOK Report on Internet Protocol, 431 Greenway Ave, Ewing, NJ 08618 USA609 882-2572 (PSTN) 703 738-6031 (Vonage) Subscription info & prices at http://cookreport.com/subscriptions.shtml Report on economic black hole of best effort networks at: http://cookreport.com/13.04.shtml E-mail cook () cookreport com
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Current thread:
- Re: best effort has economic problems Gordon Cook (May 29)
- Re: best effort has economic problems Mikael Abrahamsson (May 29)
- Re: best effort has economic problems Eric Kuhnke (May 29)
- Re: best effort has economic problems Mikael Abrahamsson (May 29)
- Cable networks RE: best effort has economic problems, maybe OT Christopher J. Wolff (May 30)
- Re: Cable networks RE: best effort has economic problems, maybe OT Petri Helenius (May 30)
- Re: Cable networks RE: best effort has economic problems, maybe OT Stephen Sprunk (May 30)
- Re: best effort has economic problems Eric Kuhnke (May 29)
- Re: best effort has economic problems Mikael Abrahamsson (May 29)
- Re: best effort has economic problems Simon Leinen (May 31)
- Re: best effort has economic problems Mikael Abrahamsson (May 31)
- Re: best effort has economic problems Vicky Rode (May 29)