more on THROW YOUR VOTE AWAY, REDUX.

[David Farber <dave () farber net>]

Begin forwarded message:

From: ritholtz () optonline net
Date: May 9, 2004 9:06:18 AM EDT
To: dave () farber net
Cc: gep2 () terabites com, ElectionProtection () yahoogroups com,  
dallasdemocrats () egroups com
Subject: Re: [IP] Fwd: THROW YOUR VOTE AWAY, REDUX.

Exactly -- I didn't even address the point of vote buying (too  
obvious). My issues are simple: making sure my vote is cast correctly,  
and making sure it is COUNTED correctly.

I cannot count how many times my fat thumbs have selected the wrong  
option on Citibank's touchscreen ATMs. (no, I do not want an account  
balance!). That's a concern with touchscreens. Especially for the  
elderly, or for the computer phobic.

The paper trail issue is a farce -- there are simply no legitimate  
technical, logistical, mechanical or budgetary reasons for not allowing  
an e-voter to know for certain his vote was cast correctly via a  
receipt. It is simply inexcusable for there not to be a verifiable  
paper trail, in the event of a recount or other problem.

I lived in Glen Cove NY a few years ago. During an interim election for  
a seat in the city council last Fall, the final vote was exactly dead  
even --3304-3304. The law mandates a recount. What happens in this  
event with no paper trail?
You can see the details here:  
http://www.longislandpress.com/v01/i48031211/news_04.asp  -- the final  
result looks to be the result of a defective absentee ballot.

Regardless, I cannot believe that we are actually discussing a  
verifiable vote and audit system. That should be the threshold for a  
voting system, not the penultimate goal. We should be focusing on  
improving voter turnout and participation, making government more  
transparent, putting more of the process online where it would be  
visible to the electorate. Its a national embarrassment -- unless you  
live in a banana republic.

Talk about low expectations . . .

 Barry L. Ritholtz
 Market Strategist
 Maxim Group
 britholtz () maximgrp com
 (212) 895-3614
 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The Big Picture:  A blog of capital markets, geopolitics, with a
dash of film!
  
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comments/










----- Original Message -----
From: gep2 () terabites com
Date: Sunday, May 9, 2004 2:44 am
Subject: [IP] Fwd: THROW YOUR VOTE AWAY, REDUX.

> This is missing the point, Dave.
>
> I don't think that anyone is seriously proposing that the voter
> LEAVE THE
> POLLING PLACE with their vote printed on a piece of paper... for
> exactly the
> reasons you're all talking about.
>
> We obviously don't want people "in authority" over the voter
> seeing how they
> voted.
>
> Likewise we don't want those voting to be able to present printed
> "proof" of how
> they voted (which would encourage vote buying or selling).
>
> The point of getting a paper copy of the ballot produced is for
> two purposes:
>
>  1)  So the voter can verify that their vote was registered
> exactly as they
> tried to cast it;
>
> and
>
>  2)  So there is a hardcopy paper ballot that could be used in a
> recount, or as
> an audit trail to verify the integrity of the voting and counting
> system.
> The paper copy, after being verified by the voter, would go into
> the urn at the
> polling place from which it would be sent to the county registrar
> as an official
> election record, to be retained for the legally specified period
> of time.
>
> What my PERSONAL feeling is for what I'd like to see done would be
> to have the
> touch-screen machines produce a printed paper copy of the ballot
> (that wouldn't
> be like a cash-register-receipt, but...) which could then be
> inserted into the
> existing (here in Dallas, anyhow) optical scanning system.
>
> That way, there would be the total from the touchscreen system,
> the total from
> the optical scanning system, AND the printed paper ballot... with
> votes that
> they user had confirmed before leaving the polling place... and
> they all
> (obviously) should agree exactly at the end of the election day.
>
> There would seem to be little value in having the voters leave
> with the paper
> copy of their choices, not only due to the privacy/anonymity
> issue, but ALSO
> because those printed copies will start becoming damaged or lost
> as soon as they
> leave the polling place... no conceivable recounting scenario
> could ever hope to
> bring them all back together again.


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