Full Disclosure mailing list archives
Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers?
From: Dan Kaminsky <dan () doxpara com>
Date: Thu, 1 Jul 2010 20:01:26 -0400
Permanent DoS's are unacceptable even from intentionally malicious traffic, let alone a few nmap flags. They're unacceptable to us, they're unacceptable to Microsoft (see: MSRC bug bar), and even Cisco PSIRT has shown up on thread desiring to clean things up. It's funny you bring up SNMP. Do you remember what happened when that protocol got fuzzed by the PROTOS guys in 2002? Every network device on the planet pretty much exploded. I will grant you that network isolation is indeed best practice, but broken code is not something to apologize for or mitigate against. It's something to apply real pressure against. If we can't get pissed, how is that QA guy supposed to block shipment? (That being said, you'll note 'it's code you just shouldn't run' is wrong. First thing's first, the network has to function. We route packets with the infrastructure we have, etc. But products that can't survive nmap are likely going to have real problems with actual exploit tools, and RCE in routers is not something to risk, 'best practice mitigations' or no.) On Jul 1, 2010, at 7:16 PM, "Dobbins, Roland" <rdobbins () arbor net> wrote:
On Jul 1, 2010, at 11:12 PM, Florian Weimer wrote:And it's certainly a bug worth fixing.I doubt it's a 'bug' which can be 'fixed', just the same as sending enough legitimate HTTP requests to a Web server to bring it to its knees isn't a 'bug' which can be 'fixed', but rather a DoS which must be mitigated via a variety of mechanisms. It would be quite helpful if the original poster would detail the models/types/ versions of the network devices in question, and possibly provide a sample query packet. Part of the general issue here is the large disconnect between the traditional security research community and the networking community; with a few notable exceptions, there isn't a lot of mutual discussion and understanding, and certainly no understanding of network infrastructure device architectures, best current practices (BCPs), and so forth. One of the most fundamental BCPs is that one must make use of various network infrastructure self-protection mechanisms to keep undesirable traffic away from the control and management planes of said network infrastructure. Here's a .pdf presentation which discusses network infrastructure self-protection: <http://files.me.com/roland.dobbins/prguob> Firing a bunch of SNMP queries at network infrastructure devices and causing network disruption as a result isn't anything new, it's a well-understood phenomenon with a well-understood - in the network operational community, at least - remedy via making use of the appropriate self-protection mechanisms built into most modern network infrastructure devices. --- -------------------------------------------------------------------- Roland Dobbins <rdobbins () arbor net> // <http://www.arbornetworks.com> Injustice is relatively easy to bear; what stings is justice. -- H.L. Mencken _______________________________________________ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
_______________________________________________ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Current thread:
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Thierry Zoller (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Dobbins, Roland (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Thierry Zoller (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Dobbins, Roland (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Florian Weimer (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? AMILABS (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Dobbins, Roland (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Dan Kaminsky (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Dobbins, Roland (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Lee (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Dobbins, Roland (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Dan Kaminsky (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? AMILABS (Jul 02)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Thierry Zoller (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Thierry Zoller (Jul 02)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Dobbins, Roland (Jul 02)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Thierry Zoller (Jul 02)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Dobbins, Roland (Jul 02)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Dobbins, Roland (Jul 01)
- Re: Should nmap cause a DoS on cisco routers? Dobbins, Roland (Jul 02)