Full Disclosure mailing list archives
Re: Publishing exploit code - what is it good for
From: bruen () coldrain net
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 08:38:30 -0400 (EDT)
Hi Aviram, There are two main problems with your analyst friend's position. The first is that he has no business deciding for me or anyone else as to whether or not my needs are legitimate. I get to decide if I need/want something (like exploit code) or not, his arrogance notwithstanding. The second point is that he, like most software vendors, have to yet to figure out that their products are consumer products and should be treated just like automobiles and toys. Consumer product testing is very public. Software is the same. We all want to know *exactly* how the product fails, just like any other consumer product, no exceptions. It is no longer about "full disclosure", it's about being just like everyone else. There is no difference between how my software gets exploited and how my child safety seat fails. cheers, bob On Thu, 30 Jun 2005, Aviram Jenik wrote:
Hi, I recently had a discussion about the concept of full disclosure with one of the top security analysts in a well-known analyst firm. Their claim was that companies that release exploit code (like us, but this is also relevant for bugtraq, full disclosure, and several security research firms) put users at risks while those at risk gain nothing from the release of the exploit. I tried the regular 'full disclosure advocacy' bit, but the analyst remained reluctant. Their claim was that based on their own work experience, a security administrator does not have a need for the exploit code itself, and the vendor information is enough. The analyst was willing to reconsider their position if an end-user came forward and talked to them about their own benefit of public exploit codes. Quote: " If I speak to an end-user organization and they express legitimate needs for exploit code, then I'll change my opinion." Help me out here. Full disclosure is important for me, as I'm sure it is for most of the people on these two lists. If you're an end-user organization and are willing to talk to this analyst and explain your view (pro-FD, I hope), drop me a note and I'll put you in direct contact. Please note: I don't need any arguments pro or against full disclosure; all this has been discussed in the past. I also don't need you to tell me about someone else or some other project (e.g. nessus, snort) that utilizes these exploits. Tried that. Didn't work. What I need is a security administrator, CSO, IT manager or sys admin that can explain why they find public exploits are good for THEIR organizations. Maybe we can start changing public opinion with regards to full disclosure, and hopefully start with this opinion leader. TIA.
-- Dr. Robert Bruen Cold Rain Technologies http://coldrain.net +1.802.579.6288 _______________________________________________ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Current thread:
- Publishing exploit code - what is it good for Aviram Jenik (Jun 30)
- Re: Publishing exploit code - what is it good for bruen (Jun 30)
- Re: Publishing exploit code - what is it good for Joachim Schipper (Jun 30)
- Re: Publishing exploit code - what is it good for Erik Fichtner (Jun 30)
- Re: Publishing exploit code - what is it good for Erick Mechler (Jun 30)
- Re: Publishing exploit code - what is it good for devnull (Jun 30)
- Re: Publishing exploit code - what is it good for James Wicks (Jun 30)
- Re: Publishing exploit code - what is it good for Anders B Jansson (Jun 30)
- Re: Publishing exploit code - what is it good for bugtraq (Jun 30)
- Re: Publishing exploit code - what is it good for Ill will (Jun 30)
- Re: Publishing exploit code - what is it good for Gary E. Miller (Jun 30)
- Re: Publishing exploit code - what is it good for Steve Milner (Jun 30)
(Thread continues...)