Full Disclosure mailing list archives
Re: ranting.. was Re: (no subject) PS
From: Ka <ka () khidr net>
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 15:39:29 +0100
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 At Dienstag, 26. November 2002 12:47 Silvio Cesare wrote:
In sociology, they will often say that power is not power unless it is excercised. ...
This is also expressed in different forms later in your letter, so it looks like that it's your opinion. Basically your idea of "power" breaks down to being able to act without having to fear consequences, if I got you correctly. But that is not power, that is simply a childish attitude, and being exercised by presidents doesn't make it any better. Everything we do has consequences, even if we don't do anything, it has consequences. Wether we like the outcome or not, is irrelevant. The very action or inaction creates the consequences. This is a law of nature. Hence blackhats are a factor in the life of whitehats and whitehats are part of blackhat environment. And 'factor' comes from 'fact'; if it came from fiction it would be called 'fictor'.
However - If it is established that disclosure is either good or evil (black/white), and we are forced to live with that (primarily through legislation, check out the DMCA and even the RedHat advisories), it simply means that the disclosure is no longer excercising freedom (intent no longer applies now, since it is legislated), but simply a false freedom given to us by the powers that be, whenever they see fit.
I have not been asked, you have not been asked, so what the hack are you calling "established" ? At most it's an RFC and as far as I see it, not even a simple majority in this list would support it without modifications. Just one sentence before that paragraph you called full disclosure "a personal choice" and seconds later you give in and bow down to "powers that be"?
Disclosure is often seen about individual responsibility. This I fully agree with - and It is not up to the "powers that be", wether it be the Government or Bill Gates, to enforce _our_ freedom upon us, and take it away without remorse.
Nobody can do that. You are giving them a power, which they don't have. The powers that be would love to tell us what to do, they would LOVE it. Because they CANNOT. And out of their incompetence, bad administration and inability to guide the software development into better territories they cry for laws. The same institutions and companies who have actively - - though sometimes indirectly and often unaware - created the world-wide situation now cry "black hat!" or "full disclosure!" or even "terrorist!". When everybody uses computers, it was Microsofts good deed, but when somebody uses M$ security flaws, it's the bad black boy who needs to be prisioned? Industry is crippling the musical art with their greed and somebody using modern technlogogy, to show how stupid the whole idea of property in the intellectual realm is, is a criminal?
Is disclosure about freedom then? I believe so.
Absolutely. But nobody needs to give it to me. I don't need laws and judges to tell me what to do, I can judge for myself. And if the laws don't cover my conscious actions, it could as well be the law which is wrong. It's OUR internet, dammn, not Microsoft's, not the property of any state or company! The internet is human property, it belongs to everybody. The first time in history we have something global, which cannot be governed and ruled by big companies or states. So it's OUR response-ability to define how we like to handle disclosure. And as far as I can see, we came up with the decision that it's a personal decision what and how to disclose. Respectful Greetings to all Ka - -- If you don't hear the ancient music in the pines, take off the copy protection from your brain. http://www.khidr.net/users/ka/pgpkey.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE944ev72vu22ltWBERAsnRAJ92q3oRpioOmXNEFc5eJpsvyOjSEACeOkIU nm68Nw2QfnZp5RlPL5V52bU= =ERW2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.netsys.com/full-disclosure-charter.html
Current thread:
- Re: (no subject) PS Euan Briggs (Nov 23)
- Re: (no subject) PS Boris Lorenz (Nov 26)
- ranting.. was Re: (no subject) PS Silvio Cesare (Nov 26)
- Re: ranting.. was Re: (no subject) PS Ka (Nov 26)
- Re: ranting.. was Re: (no subject) PS Boris Lorenz (Nov 26)
- Re: (no subject) PS anakata (Nov 26)
- ranting.. was Re: (no subject) PS Silvio Cesare (Nov 26)
- <Possible follow-ups>
- RE: (no subject) PS Schmehl, Paul L (Nov 26)
- RE: (no subject) PS Gregory Kornblum (Nov 26)
- Re: (no subject) PS Boris Lorenz (Nov 26)