WebApp Sec mailing list archives
RE: Token authentication with web applications
From: "Graham Howe" <sammie40 () telus net>
Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2004 11:44:03 -0700
Hi guys, I'm sorry but, like our programmer, I don't get the SMS / hardware etc. solutions - they are, by their very nature, exclusive - you would never get all 8 million of BOA's online clients to adopt them, for example - and, in addition, many of them are not international in nature - cell phone solutions being typical The only real solutions we can see are software based. On the other hand, we would say that - we sell the software ! Graham Howe VP of Marketing www.dualshield.com -----Original Message----- From: sfdl01 [mailto:sfdl01 () leach net au] Sent: July 2, 2004 5:53 AM To: Michael Silk Cc: Ivan Krstic; webappsec () securityfocus com Subject: RE: Token authentication with web applications Something I've seen come up on the odd occasion more recently is out-of-band authentication using (in Europe and Asia) SMS to the users' GSM phone. The SMS contains a onetime password that the user enters into their web browser. The is typically after the user has entered in a password that they know (to prevent a dos attack on the users' phone phone :). It is not what I would call real two factor authentication, but if you can handle the overhead of an sms every time your users log in, then..? Otherwise you could look at one of the more traditional token based systems such as SecureID for a time based, or a DES calculator that handles a challenge response type system. Lastly, vendors have started knocking up small smartcard readers with a pinpad (like a des calculator i guess, but the keys are on a smart card) to handle smart card auth in situations where a pc might not have a traditional card reader attached. i believe some of these devices sell for <US$10, then you've got to personalise your chip card as well though.
Hi, As far as I have found is that the secure systems will perform some computation on the card itself, the computation is such that it is secure (i.e. no private data leaves the card, and other such things) So, in your situation obviously the computer where the key is plugged into isn't considered secure; so computation can't be done there. Perhaps you could look into utilising the users' palm pilots? If they have them ... If not, well, the only solution is to use a system that can be copied (i.e. cd's, printouts, and so on) and accepting the risk. Potentially (and this is just a very rough suggestion) you could have a secure server and the users' computers can request a token from that. (i.e. try and emulate the computational card-based system utilising a server instead of the card). -- Michael -----Original Message----- From: Ivan Krstic [mailto:krstic () fas harvard edu] Sent: Friday, 2 July 2004 8:48 AM To: webappsec () securityfocus com Subject: Token authentication with web applications All, I'm looking for people's experiences with cheap, uncomplicated token devices or other physical means of authentication that play nicely with more traditional authentication methods in web applications. The cheapest solutions that came to mind are printing credit-card sized s/key cards, or burning mini-CDs with a key and an auth agent for users. Obviously, both methods are flawed (s/key cards can be copied down if left exposed, and that's assuming they're not taped to the monitor, while a stolen CD can be copied and replaced without evidence of tampering[1]), but would still raise the security bar at essentially no cost. More extensive authentication solutions are usually rather expensive. Thoughts? Cheers, Ivan. [1] The s/key printed cards at least address this insofar as the user, presuming he can be bothered with remembering which of the 100 s/keys he used last, can notice that an intruder gained access to the system. This email message and accompanying data may contain information that is confidential and/or subject to legal privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, you are notified that any use, dissemination, distribution or copying of this message or data is prohibited. If you have received this email message in error, please notify us immediately and erase all copies of this message and attachments. This email is for your convenience only, you should not rely on any information contained herein for contractual or legal purposes. You should only rely on information and/or instructions in writing and on company letterhead signed by authorised persons.
Current thread:
- Token authentication with web applications Ivan Krstic (Jul 01)
- <Possible follow-ups>
- RE: Token authentication with web applications Michael Silk (Jul 02)
- RE: Token authentication with web applications sfdl01 (Jul 02)
- RE: Token authentication with web applications Graham Howe (Jul 02)
- Re: Token authentication with web applications Ivan Krstic (Jul 02)
- RE: Token authentication with web applications sfdl01 (Jul 02)
- RE: Token authentication with web applications Levenglick, Jeff (Jul 02)
- RE: Token authentication with web applications Scovetta, Michael V (Jul 04)
- RE: Token authentication with web applications stevenr (Jul 05)