FC: Stu Baker replies to Echelon post, defends U.S. intel agencies

[Declan McCullagh <declan () well com>]

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In response to: http://www.politechbot.com/p-02078.html
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From: "Baker, Stewart" <SBaker () steptoe com>
To: "'declan () well com'" <declan () well com>
cc: "Albertazzie, Sally" <SAlbertazzie () steptoe com>
Subject: RE: More on Echelon, intercepts, and a quick history lesson
Date: Wed, 30 May 2001 12:10:43 -0400

Declan,

Jonathan is right, your rant notwithstanding.  The people who choose careers
in national security do it mainly for reasons of patriotism, and certainly
not so they can be part of a patronage machine.  Such a use of intelligence
would be reported quickly to Congressional oversight bodies that have often
been in the hands of the opposition party.

To do corporate espionage, there would have to be an intimate relationship
between intelligence agencies and the US corporate sector, a relationship of
a kind that has never existed in our country.  Since such relationships do
exist in other countries, though, including some European countries, it's
easy to see why Europeans keep suspecting the US of corporate espionage.  Of
course, that also suggests that at least some European intelligence agencies
are doing corporate espionage -- against both the US and their fellow EU
members.  Remarkably, given all the handwaving in this report about the risk
of US corporate espionage, the report says little or nothing about the risk
that some EU members are spying on corporations from other EU members.
Since that's a problem the European Parliament actually could do something
about fairly efficiently, the determined focus on US capabilities suggests
that this effort is more about disrupting the US-UK intelligence
relationship than about the problem of corporate espionage.

Stewart Baker
Steptoe & Johnson LLP
1330 Connecticut Avenue, N.W.
Washington, DC 20036
phone -- 202.429.6413
email fax -- 202.261.9825
main fax -- 202.429.3902
sbaker () steptoe com

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To: jonathan.winkler () yale edu
cc: declan () well com, duncan () gn apc org
Subject: Re: FC: More on Echelon, intercepts, and a quick history lesson
In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 30 May 2001 10:07:37 EDT." 
<5.0.2.1.0.20010529122647.020d3b00 () mail well com>
Date: Wed, 30 May 2001 16:10:40 +0100
From: Ian BROWN <I.Brown () cs ucl ac uk>

You wrote:
>it would seem to be all
>but impossible for a US (or UK, in the earlier case) government agency
>to come up with a way to distribute the corporate intelligence equitably
>to the beneficiary companies.  If, for example, the US learned a French
>firm were going to bid low on an important contract, how on earth would
>it decide which US firm to provide the information to without the others
>spilling the beans?

Declan replied:
>I respectfully disagree with Jonathan's position, at least as I understand
>it. Much has changed since the early 1900s, and the executive branch now is
>entirely capable of picking corporate favorites in the marketplace...
>
>I admit that the NSA has a far greater interest in keeping its sources
>secret than the White House does in rewarding donors. And I have not seen
>reliable evidence showing Echelon intercepts are used in this manner.

The procedures for deidentifying and routing intelligence to commercial
companies seem to be substantially in place...

From: "Armin Medosch" <armin () easynet co uk>
To: nettime-l () bbs thing net
Date: Mon, 28 May 2001 12:32:06 +0200
Subject: <nettime> Echelon: new documents on economic espionage and human 
rights

...

Four new studies on "Interception Capabilities - Impact and
Exploitation" were commissioned by the Temporary Committee on
the Echelon Interception System of the European Parliament in
December 2000. They cover the use of communications
intelligence (COMINT) for economic purposes, legal and human
rights issues, and recent political and technological developments.
Among the key topics covered are the documentary and factual
evidence for the existence of the COMSAT (communications
satellite) intercept system known as "ECHELON".

These studies were presented to the Echelon Committee at its
Brussels meeting on 22 and 23 January 2001...

IC2001, paper 2: COMINT impact on international trade
http://www.heise.de/tp/deutsch/special/ech/7752/1.html

Paper 2 sets out, with detailed sources, the case that from 1992 to
date Europe is likely to have sustained significant employment and
financial loss as a result of the U.S. government policy of "levelling
the playing field", introduced in 1991.   It also refers to:

Annexe 2-1
Background papers about the U.S. Trade Promotion Co-ordinating
Committee (TPCC) and the Advocacy Center, including statements
of purpose
http://www.heise.de/tp/deutsch/special/ech/7743/1.html

Annexe 2-2
A questionaire for U.S. companies to answer in order to determine
whether or not they are deemed "American" and thus qualify for
official assistance.
http://www.heise.de/tp/deutsch/special/ech/7744/1.html

The questionnaire is also on the internet
http://www.ita.doc.gov/td/advocacy/question.htm

Annexe 2-3
Documents revealing the CIA's role in U.S. trade promotion,
obtained under the Freedom of Information Act.
http://www.heise.de/tp/deutsch/special/ech/7749/1.html
--
"Nobody wants to type in a credit card number without getting something you 
can hold in your hand. Otherwise, porn wouldn't be the only really 
profitable e-commerce model." --suck.com

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From: "Armin Medosch" <armin () easynet co uk>
To: declan () well com
Date: Wed, 30 May 2001 18:06:32 +0200
Subject: Re: FC: More on Echelon, intercepts, and a quick history lesson
Reply-to: armin () easynet co uk
In-reply-to: <5.0.2.1.0.20010529122647.020d3b00 () mail well com>

On 30 May 01, at 10:07, Declan McCullagh wrote:

> What David and I agreed upon, however, was that it would seem to be all
> but impossible for a US (or UK, in the earlier case) government agency
> to come up with a way to distribute the corporate intelligence equitably
> to the beneficiary companies.

Its not that difficult. The Clinton administration  created the trade promotion
 co-ordinating comitee and the advocacy center.
Look at
http://www.heise.de/tp/english/inhalt/te/7753/1.html

yours
Armin

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