Nmap Announce mailing list archives
Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime
From: Simple Nomad <thegnome () nmrc org>
Date: Sun, 4 Jun 2000 22:49:52 -0500 (CDT)
On Sat, 3 Jun 2000, Matt Marnell wrote:
for all you who still don't see how nmap is banned in this treaty (and I don't blame you...it took a second look for me to catch it too), here is how it applies: When you scan a system, you are accessing that system (whether you have permission or not). Now, nmap scans computer systems.
Define access. Under current law within the U.S., the traditional "de facto standard" access that is considered illegal involves direct interaction and access to the data contained within that computer. This is why the FBI has stated scanning is not illegal, and they cannot and will not even try to prosecute someone solely based upon scanning (this is straight from the horse's mouth, from the FBI's Dallas computer crime guys who worked the Global Hell and Phonemaster cases, told to me personally). Now this does not mean they aren't interested in who is scanning, and would love for people who are scanned to share logs with them, as it is fairly common that a person who scans a lot against systems she/he does not directly control will often try to "directly control" them shortly afterward. It is very possible that the legislation used to enact our participation in this treaty will be considered to "already exist", and since the Feds won't usually touch a case unless there is at least $10k of damage (with a few minor exceptions, but certainly scanning is not an exception, once again from the horse's mouth) it is a moot point. As a researcher I do not think twice about scanning a site, although I often will follow up with an email explaining what I was doing if it is more than a quick one-target scan. I will continue to do it until scanning itself has been specifically labeled as illegal, which I seriously doubt will happen anytime soon. If so, it will be like speeding -- most people will get away with it because they will not get caught. - Simple Nomad - No rest for the Wicca'd - - thegnome () nmrc org - www.nmrc.org - - thegnome () razor bindview com - razor.bindview.com -
Current thread:
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime, (continued)
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime Bart van Leeuwen (Jun 02)
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime Mike Black (Jun 03)
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime dhaag (Jun 03)
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime Bart van Leeuwen (Jun 03)
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime David Dennis (Jun 03)
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime Mike Black (Jun 03)
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime White Vampire (Jun 03)
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime Tyler Allison (Jun 03)
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime Matt Marnell (Jun 03)
- RE: Draft Convention on Cybercrime Marjorie Simmons (Jun 03)
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime Jeff Simmons (Jun 03)
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime Simple Nomad (Jun 04)
- RE: Draft Convention on Cybercrime Marjorie Simmons (Jun 05)
- Re: Draft Convention on Cybercrime Bart van Leeuwen (Jun 02)