Re: Low cost WDM gear

[Faisal Imtiaz <faisal () snappytelecom net>]

Maybe, your experience was the pivotal event that became a turning point in their customer service attitudes... 

:) 

Faisal Imtiaz 
Snappy Internet & Telecom 
7266 SW 48 Street 
Miami, FL 33155 
Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: Support () Snappytelecom net 

----- Original Message -----

> From: "Kenneth McRae" <kenneth.mcrae () me com>
> To: "Faisal Imtiaz" <faisal () snappytelecom net>
> Cc: "Rodrigo 1telecom" <rodrigo () 1telecom com br>, "NANOG" <nanog () nanog org>
> Sent: Saturday, February 7, 2015 4:24:18 PM
> Subject: Re: Low cost WDM gear

> Point taken on the specs.. Still doesn't excuse poor customer service and
> tech support. I never expect to be told that no refund will be issued when I
> am dissatisfied with the product. A request for RMA because something is not
> working as expected should not have to be escalated to the President of the
> company.

> Other than that I am sure FiberStore is a great company :-)

> On Feb 07, 2015, at 01:17 PM, Faisal Imtiaz <faisal () snappytelecom net> wrote:

> > My point is......
>
> > ... The thing to rely on is/are the Specs.
>
> > If the Specs are right or specs are wrong, that is what determines the
> > product's mfg shortcoming (defect).

> > Mfg. Engineers are people, just like you and me.... and people can make
> > mistakes...
>
> > Being an Engineer, when I ask someone to do the design work, I ask them to
> > explain it, and this way I double check their work.... Yes Mfg. Engineers
> > are known to F***up too.

> > While it is expected to be disappointed when something does not work.. and
> > having a bad taste for dealing with that mfg, claiming that all of that mfg
> > products are bad is a whole different issue.

> > I deal with FiberStore, my experience have been very different, when stuff
> > purchased from them, did not meet the specs, they took it back no questions
> > asked.

> > Regards.

> > Faisal Imtiaz
>
> > Snappy Internet & Telecom
>
> > 7266 SW 48 Street
>
> > Miami, FL 33155
>
> > Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

> > Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: Support () Snappytelecom net

> > ----- Original Message -----

> > > From: "Kenneth McRae" <kenneth.mcrae () me com>
>
> > > To: "Faisal Imtiaz" <faisal () snappytelecom net>
>
> > > Cc: "Rodrigo 1telecom" <rodrigo () 1telecom com br>, "NANOG"
> > > <nanog () nanog org>
>
> > > Sent: Saturday, February 7, 2015 4:01:29 PM
>
> > > Subject: Re: Low cost WDM gear

> > > That's true up to a point. Specs are only as good as the entity providing
> > > the
> > > data. I can tell you a few stories about specs and some MAJOR fails by a
> > > major network equipment manufacturer failing to meet advertised specs.
> > > When
> > > you engage the engineering folks to assist in a build, they should know
> > > the
> > > true specs of their gear better than anyone else. If they say for a
> > > certain
> > > distance that A+B will work, then that is exactly what I expect.

> > > That is pretty basic.

> > > On Feb 07, 2015, at 12:56 PM, Faisal Imtiaz <faisal () snappytelecom net>
> > > wrote:

> > > > More power to you ....

> > > > I always get a chuckle out of statements such as ... "Compared
> > > > FiberStore
> > > > to
> > > > another Vendor"...

> > > > It was pointed out to me long time ago.... when someone said.. "My
> > > > Chevy
> > > > is
> > > > better than a Ford"....
>
> > > > Someone pointed out, hey, which Chevy ? the Chevette ? or the Corvette
> > > > ?
> > > > and
> > > > Which Ford the Fiesta or Mustang ?

> > > > Every mfg. has a lots and lots of products, and they are always getting
> > > > improved...

> > > > One has to pay attention to the specs.. even the same model products at
> > > > different times don't have the same specs !

> > > > :)

> > > > Faisal Imtiaz
>
> > > > Snappy Internet & Telecom
>
> > > > 7266 SW 48 Street
>
> > > > Miami, FL 33155
>
> > > > Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

> > > > Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: Support () Snappytelecom net

> > > > ----- Original Message -----

> > > > > From: "Kenneth McRae" <kenneth.mcrae () me com>
>
> > > > > To: "Faisal Imtiaz" <faisal () snappytelecom net>
>
> > > > > Cc: "Rodrigo 1telecom" <rodrigo () 1telecom com br>, "NANOG"
> > > > > <nanog () nanog org>
>
> > > > > Sent: Saturday, February 7, 2015 3:49:16 PM
>
> > > > > Subject: Re: Low cost WDM gear

> > > > > That's why I engage the engineering resources on their end to make
> > > > > sure
> > > > > the
> > > > > chosen candidate will support the use case. I have now performed an
> > > > > A/B
> > > > > comparison and the FiberStore gear is inferior. Excessive loss on the
> > > > > mux
> > > > > and optics.

> > > > > On Feb 07, 2015, at 12:44 PM, Faisal Imtiaz
> > > > > <faisal () snappytelecom net>
> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > If you pay close attention to the Spec Sheets, on power output,
> > > > > > insertion
> > > > > > loss, sensitivity, and do the proper calculation for your link,
> > > > > > then
> > > > > > using
> > > > > > anyone's products, passive or active will work unless the devices
> > > > > > do
> > > > > > not
> > > > > > meet specified specs.

> > > > > > If you don't do your homework, cals on the design, loss, and just
> > > > > > buy
> > > > > > stuff
> > > > > > based on whatever, then it does not matter who the mfg. is, you are
> > > > > > very
> > > > > > very likely to be surprised in a bad way.

> > > > > > :)

> > > > > > Faisal Imtiaz
>
> > > > > > Snappy Internet & Telecom

> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----

> > > > > > > From: "Rodrigo 1telecom" < rodrigo () 1telecom com br >
>
> > > > > > > To: "Kenneth McRae" < kenneth.mcrae () me com >
>
> > > > > > > Cc: "NANOG" < nanog () nanog org >
>
> > > > > > > Sent: Saturday, February 7, 2015 3:24:43 PM
>
> > > > > > > Subject: Re: Low cost WDM gear
>
> > > > > > > What others vendors do you using? Here in Brazil only PADTEC have
> > > > > > > this
>
> > > > > > > passive solution... Some days ago Digitel contact me to show your
> > > > > > > multiplex
>
> > > > > > > solution... Is a active solution...
>
> > > > > > > We import this from fiberstore, but i don't know others vendors
> > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > buy
> > > > > > > 10G
>
> > > > > > > sfp+ cwdm and this mux/demux...
>
> > > > > > > Enviado via iPhone 
>
> > > > > > > Grupo Connectoway
>
> > > > > > > > Em 07/02/2015, às 16:04, Kenneth McRae < kenneth.mcrae () me com >
> > > > > > > > escreveu:
>
> > > > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > > Hi Enviado,
>
> > > > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > > I cannot recommend FiberStore as I had a bad experience with
> > > > > > > > them.
> > > > > > > > I
>
> > > > > > > > needed to cover only 3km from A to B side. When using 10km
> > > > > > > > optics,
> > > > > > > > I
> > > > > > > > saw
>
> > > > > > > > a loss of over 5db with their passive mux inserted into the
> > > > > > > > path
> > > > > > > > which
>
> > > > > > > > created a total loss of over -20db which is outside of the
> > > > > > > > tolerances
> > > > > > > > for
>
> > > > > > > > our equipment with 10km SFP+. Using another vendors low
> > > > > > > > insertion
> > > > > > > > loss
>
> > > > > > > > mux corrected our issue. I am sure if you are using an 80km
> > > > > > > > optic,
> > > > > > > > you
>
> > > > > > > > may be able to tolerate a higher insertion loss to cover <
> > > > > > > > 60km.
> > > > > > > > I
> > > > > > > > also
>
> > > > > > > > notice that their CDWM optics averaged about 3db less in power
> > > > > > > > output
> > > > > > > > when
>
> > > > > > > > compared to other vendors.
>
> > > > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > > Thanks
>
> > > > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > > Kenneth
>
> > > > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > > > On Feb 07, 2015, at 10:33 AM, Rodrigo 1telecom <
> > > > > > > > > rodrigo () 1telecom com br
> > > > > > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > > > Hi kenneth... which the distance do you have from side A to
> > > > > > > > > side
> > > > > > > > > B
> > > > > > > > > when
>
> > > > > > > > > you using passive solutions from fiberstore( mux and demux)?
>
> > > > > > > > > I buy this mux and demux(4 channels single fiber) and only
> > > > > > > > > make
> > > > > > > > > a
> > > > > > > > > test
>
> > > > > > > > > about 60km( mux side A and demux on side B) with sfp+10gb for
> > > > > > > > > 80km...
> > > > > > > > > (
>
> > > > > > > > > only see ddm on my ex3300( about -19db for 60km). Test switch
> > > > > > > > > access
> > > > > > > > > with
>
> > > > > > > > > ssh and pinging tests...
>
> > > > > > > > > What kind os issue do you have? For distances less than 60km
> > > > > > > > > is
> > > > > > > > > this
>
> > > > > > > > > solution good?
>
> > > > > > > > > Thanks!!!
>
> > > > > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > > > Enviado via iPhone 
>
> > > > > > > > > Grupo Connectoway
>
> > > > > > > > >
>
> > > > > > > > > > Em 07/02/2015, às 14:55, Kenneth McRae < kenneth.mcrae () me com
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > escreveu:
>
> > > > > > > > > > Mike,
>
> > > > > > > > > > I just replaced a bunch of FiberStore WDM passive muxes with
> > > > > > > > > > OSI
> > > > > > > > > > Hardware
>
> > > > > > > > > > equipment. The FiberStore gear was a huge disappointment
> > > > > > > > > > (excessive
>
> > > > > > > > > > loss, poor technical support, refusal to issue refund without
>
> > > > > > > > > > threatening legal action, etc.). I have had good results from
> > > > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > OSI
>
> > > > > > > > > > equipment so far. I run passive muxes for CWDM (8 - 16
> > > > > > > > > > channels).
>
> > > > > > > > > > On Feb 07, 2015, at 09:51 AM, Manuel Marín <
> > > > > > > > > > mmg () transtelco net
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > Hi Mike
>
> > > > > > > > > > I can recommend a couple of vendors that provide cost
> > > > > > > > > > effective
>
> > > > > > > > > > solutions.
>
> > > > > > > > > > Ekinops & Packetlight.
>
> > > > > > > > > > On Saturday, February 7, 2015, Mike Hammett <
> > > > > > > > > > nanog () ics-il net
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > I know there are various Asian vendors for low cost (less
> > > > > > > > > > than
> > > > > > > > > > $500)
>
> > > > > > > > > > muxes
>
> > > > > > > > > > to throw 16 or however many colors onto a strand. However,
> > > > > > > > > > they
> > > > > > > > > > don't
>
> > > > > > > > > > work
>
> > > > > > > > > > so well when you don't control the optics used on both sides
> > > > > > > > > > (therefore
>
> > > > > > > > > > must use standard wavelengths), obviously only do a handful
> > > > > > > > > > of
> > > > > > > > > > channels
>
> > > > > > > > > > and
>
> > > > > > > > > > have a distance limitation.
>
> > > > > > > > > > What solutions are out there that don't cost an arm and a
> > > > > > > > > > leg?
>
> > > > > > > > > > -----
>
> > > > > > > > > > Mike Hammett
>
> > > > > > > > > > Intelligent Computing Solutions
>
> > > > > > > > > > http://www.ics-il.com
>
> > > > > > > > > > --
>
> > > > > > > > > > TRANSTELCO| Manuel Marin | VP Engineering | US: *+1
> > > > > > > > > > 915-217-2232*
> > > > > > > > > > |
> > > > > > > > > > MX:
>
> > > > > > > > > > *+52
>
> > > > > > > > > > 656-257-1109*
>
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