nanog mailing list archives
RE: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can.
From: "Naslund, Steve" <SNaslund () medline com>
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2012 15:01:53 -0600
-----Original Message----- From: Rich Kulawiec [mailto:rsk () gsp org] Sent: Friday, November 30, 2012 6:59 AM To: nanog () nanog org Subject: Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please
help if you can.
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 08:04:02AM -0500, Chris quoted (William): Yes, it happened to me now as well - Yesterday i got raided for someone sharing child pornography over one of my Tor exits.
Question: what evidence has been published -- that is, placed
somewhere that we can all see it -- that substantiates the claim that child porn
traversed the node in question?
The cops don't have to present evidence until there is a court case. Since this guy was not arrested, they have apparently not decided to charge him yet. The apparently had some evidence to get the seizure order. They have to convince a judge, not the public.
Followup question 1: if no such evidence has been produced, then why
should we believe that it exists? Extraordinary claims require extraordinary
proof.
Again, no evidence needed until a prosecution happens. Just enough for the cops to convince a judge to allow the evidence seizure.
Followup question 2: if the goal is to identify and apprehend the
perpetrators of child porn (and that's a good goal) then why would the police raid >this operation? Would it not make far more sense to take advantage of the operator's knowledge and experience and quietly ask for his/her cooperation >*while leaving the node running*? Maybe the cops think he is a perpetrator. It is not unthinkable that he set up a network to hide his own activities. Note that they seized his HOME storage devices, not the Tor server.
Followup question 3: what evidence in front of us allows us to clearly
discern that this is what it purports to be and not simply an attempt to shut >down a Tor node (and intimidate the operators of others) by using a plausible excuse based on a universal hot-button issue? Since the individual indicates that the Tor node was already down and the police did not seize it, what makes you think that it was the target at all. The individual only indicated that the police asked about the IP address used by the Tor server during his questioning so it is possible they did not know it was a Tor node and maybe thought it was at his apartment. I have yet to see anything indicating that he is not allowed to bring his Tor node back online. I am not assuming this is only about the Tor node just because the cops asked him about it. I am a little concerned that this guy keeps a safe deposit box with a burner phone and cash around. Is he a CIA agent? :) Why would I donate to his legal defense when he has not been charged yet? A little premature, no?
---rsk
Steven Naslund
Current thread:
- Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can., (continued)
- Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. George Herbert (Nov 29)
- RE: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Naslund, Steve (Nov 29)
- RE: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law (Nov 29)
- RE: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Naslund, Steve (Nov 30)
- Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Will Hargrave (Nov 29)
- Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Joakim Aronius (Nov 30)
- Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Jeroen Massar (Nov 30)
- Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Barry Shein (Nov 30)
- Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Owen DeLong (Nov 30)
- RE: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Naslund, Steve (Nov 30)
- Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Peter Kristolaitis (Nov 30)
- RE: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Naslund, Steve (Nov 30)
- Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Peter Kristolaitis (Nov 30)
- RE: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can. Naslund, Steve (Nov 30)
- Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if Joe Greco (Nov 30)
- RE: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if Naslund, Steve (Nov 30)
- RE: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if goemon (Nov 30)
- Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if George Herbert (Nov 30)