nanog mailing list archives
Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right?
From: Dave CROCKER <dhc2 () dcrocker net>
Date: Thu, 05 Jan 2012 10:29:10 -0800
On 1/5/2012 7:36 AM, Marshall Eubanks wrote:
On Thu, Jan 5, 2012 at 10:22 AM, Jay Ashworth<jra () baylink com> wrote:Vint Cerf says no: http://j.mp/wwL9IpWith all due respect to Vint, I think that it isn't now, but it will be.
With all due respect for the view that it will be, I'll suggest that this entirely misses the point of his op-ed.
His point is to distinguish means versus ends and that something as basic as a human right needs to be about ends, not means.
Means often change -- sometimes quickly -- but ends are typically quite stable. Discussion about means needs to be in terms of the ends they serve.
From the US perspective, speech and assembly are examples of rights.The 'right' to telephone service is not a direct right; it's a derivative of the speech right, I believe. Onerous assembly laws are examples of unacceptable means. The Internet is a set of means. (Zaid's concrete example about blog blocking is also on point.)
Broadly, we need to be careful to distinguish between core issues (rights, causes, and the like) from derivative and surface issues (means, symptoms, and the like. It's extremely easy to get caught up with the details of means and symptoms and entirely miss the underlying, strategic issues.
d/ -- Dave Crocker Brandenburg InternetWorking bbiw.net
Current thread:
- Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Jay Ashworth (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Marshall Eubanks (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Dave CROCKER (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Leo Bicknell (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Jay Ashworth (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Leo Bicknell (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Dave Israel (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Leo Bicknell (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Jon Schipp (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Valdis . Kletnieks (Jan 05)
- RE: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Nathan Eisenberg (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Kevin Stange (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Zaid Ali (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Jay Ashworth (Jan 05)
- Re: Whacky Weekend: Is Internet Access a Human Right? Marshall Eubanks (Jan 05)