nanog mailing list archives
RE: TCP congestion control and large router buffers
From: "George Bonser" <gbonser () seven com>
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2010 09:28:25 -0800
On Tue, 14 Dec 2010, Sam Stickland wrote:But there's no need for AQM, just smaller buffers would make a huge difference.Well, yes, buffering packets more than let's say 30-50ms on a 1 meg link doesn't make much sense. But doing some basic AQM would make things even better (some packets would see 0 buffering instead of 30ms).Surely buffers that can store seconds worth of data are simply toobig? FIFO with seconds worth of data is just silly, yes. -- Mikael Abrahamsson
Well, Jim Getty was reporting seeing "tens of seconds" of buffering (comments in the original LWN link to his first posting) which is just ludicrous. No TCP stack is going to respond properly to congestion with that sort of delay. Some form of AQM is probably a good thing as would be the wider use of ECN. Finding out that a buffer filled and a packet (or many packets) was dropped five seconds after the fact, isn't going to help anyone and you just end up whipsawing the window size (Lawrence Welk effect http://www.oeta.onenet.net/welk/PM/images/Lawrence.jpg ?). I would favor seeing more use of ECN so that a sender can be notified to back off when a buffer is approaching capacity but there is apparently still a lot of hardware out there that has problems with it. You need enough buffering to satisfy packets "in flight" for a connection on the other side of the planet but man, what he has been reporting is just insane and it would be no wonder performance can be crap.
Current thread:
- TCP congestion control and large router buffers Vasil Kolev (Dec 09)
- Re: TCP congestion control and large router buffers Mikael Abrahamsson (Dec 09)
- Message not available
- Re: TCP congestion control and large router buffers Mikael Abrahamsson (Dec 13)
- Message not available
- Re: TCP congestion control and large router buffers Mikael Abrahamsson (Dec 14)
- RE: TCP congestion control and large router buffers George Bonser (Dec 14)
- RE: TCP congestion control and large router buffers Mikael Abrahamsson (Dec 14)
- Message not available
- Re: TCP congestion control and large router buffers Mikael Abrahamsson (Dec 09)
- Re: TCP congestion control and large router buffers Jim Gettys (Dec 20)
- Re: TCP congestion control and large router buffers Mikael Abrahamsson (Dec 20)
- Re: TCP congestion control and large router buffers Sam Stickland (Dec 21)
- Re: TCP congestion control and large router buffers Fred Baker (Dec 21)
- Re: TCP congestion control and large router buffers Jim Gettys (Dec 22)
- Re: TCP congestion control and large router buffers Fred Baker (Dec 22)
- RE: TCP congestion control and large router buffers George Bonser (Dec 22)
- Re: TCP congestion control and large router buffers Carsten Bormann (Dec 23)