RE: People who purchase unproven technologies to support their Business, and whine about it. RE: To CAIS Engineers - WAKE UP AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR CUSTOMERS

["Joe Marr" <jmarr () twmaine com>]

"Since their business does not rely on thier line, they can do without more
expensive connection."

Right, absolutely. If I was a small printer in Albany, New York, and I
wanted a cheap affordable connection to browse the web on, or send some
email then yes, xDSL or Cable would be my choice. But if I had a businees
that relied on the internet, and the impact of an outage would severly
hamper my ability to conduct such business. Then the last thing I would do
is rely on xDSL (not including HDSL which is the technology the some T1's
are ran over).

Besides, if you need a /23 routed for you, then you are a small to medium
size business.

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-nanog () merit edu [mailto:owner-nanog () merit edu]On Behalf Of
Wojtek Zlobicki
Sent: Monday, May 14, 2001 8:17 AM
To: jmarr () twmaine com; 'John Palmer (NANOG Acct)'
Cc: nanog () nanog org
Subject: Re: People who purchase unproven technologies to support their
Business, and whine about it. RE: To CAIS Engineers - WAKE UP AND TAKE
CARE OF YOUR CUSTOMERS



Joe,

    You have to look at economies of scale.  A small to medium sized
business cannot afford to colocate or purchase more reliable bandwidth.
Since their business does not rely on thier line, they can do without more
expensive connection.  Second, they may be upgrading from other technologies
such as ISDN or POTS.  DSL is far from a reliable technology, yet quite far
from an unreliable technology.  I sit on the fence in regrards to its
performance and other characteristics.  The work that I have done working
for a CLEC has shown me that a line that works well from the start is likely
to stay up for weeks/months.



-----Original Message-----
From: owner-nanog () merit edu [mailto:owner-nanog () merit edu]On Behalf Of
Alex Rubenstein
Sent: Sunday, May 13, 2001 9:03 PM
To: John Palmer (NANOG Acct)
Cc: nanog () nanog org
Subject: Re: To CAIS Engineers - WAKE UP AND TAKE CARE OF YOUR CUSTOMERS



Welp, you are the one who picked xDSL for your business...



On Sun, 13 May 2001, John Palmer (NANOG Acct) wrote:

> <FLAME ON>
>
> It has been a trying time at CAIS in the last few days, I'm sure.
>
> PSINet dumped all of their DSL customers onto CAIS. Covad is the backhaul
> provider for them both. Need I say more?
>
> Bottom line, I dont know how many thousands of people were without service
> for more than a day because the whole transfer was botched.
>
> We have a situation where we had a DSL connection from PSI and were using
> our own  IP addresses. Problem is that no one changed the
> routing tables and the packets dead-ended at PSI.
>
> Getting CAIS to fix this problem has been a nightmare. At first, PSI didnt
> stop announcing the routes and now that they have, it seems that
> CAIS will not announce the routes till Monday becuase "no one at our NOC
> knows how to do this and the one guy (ONE GUY IN THE WHOLE
> COMPANY - AND THEY ARE A NATIONWIDE PROVIDER????) who knows how doesn't
work
> weekends."
>
> Bottom line from CAIS:" S***W the customers, we dont work weekends. We
don't
> care that your entire business has been dead in the water since
> Wednesday, you can go to H**L, we'll get to it Monday, if we feel like
it."
> Our lawyers are looking at what actions we can take against them. It may
be
> trickey, but we will try.
>
> Needless to say, we will be moving our connection. I have some choice
words
> for them when they send us our first monthly bill, which I'm certain, they
> will do on weekends just fine.
>
> IF SOMEONE IS THERE AT CAIS - GET OFF OF YOUR LAZY A** AND PUT THOSE
> ANNOUNCEMENTS INTO YOUR BGP4
> TABLES TODAY (NOT MONDAY, NOT LATER IN THE WEEK)- THERE ARE ABOUT 6 OF
YOUR
> CUSTOMERS (NOT JUST US)
> WHO ARE DEAD IN THE WATER BECAUSE YOU ARE TOO LAZY TO DO A 20 SECOND JOB.
>
> <flame off - sorry to the list for being so loud>
> John