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Re From a nyt and long time iper Re New York Times defends hiring extreme climate denier: 'millions agree with him'

From: "Dave Farber" <farber () gmail com>
Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2017 16:39:08 -0400



Begin forwarded message:


From: Stephen Fulton <sfulton () esoteric ca>
Date: April 22, 2017 at 4:37:20 PM EDT
To: dave () farber net
Subject: Re: [IP] Re From a nyt and long time iper Re New York Times defends hiring extreme climate denier: 'millions 
agree with him'

Hi Dave,

For IP if you want..

I cannot help but think the climate debate would be less divisive if some people had not taken it up as a means for 
radical political and economic change in the late 80's and early 90's.  The hard-left cottoned to it around the 1992 
Rio conference, which spurred some on the right to reject the idea of climate change because they saw it as a tool of 
that agenda.  And now, here we are.

-- Stephen



On 2017-04-22 2:46 PM, Dave Farber wrote:

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: Esther Dyson <edyson () edventure com <mailto:edyson () edventure com>>
Date: Sat, Apr 22, 2017 at 2:13 PM
Subject: Re: [IP] Re From a nyt and long time iper Re New York Times
defends hiring extreme climate denier: 'millions agree with him'
To: David Farber <dave () farber net <mailto:dave () farber net>>
Cc: ip <ip () listbox com <mailto:ip () listbox com>>


Yes, there’s a huge difference between the editorial page and the news
pages - at least in both the NY Times and the Wall Street Journal….

just as there are differences among denying climate change,
acknowledging that there is a change but denying that humans caused the
change, affirming that we know how to fix it, and urging that we take
the risk of intervening because our predictions indicate that
intervention is the last risky path (though which interventions in
particular, and at whose short-term expense…..??)





On Apr 22, 2017, at 1:23 PM, Dave Farber <farber () gmail com
<mailto:farber () gmail com>> wrote:




Begin forwarded message:


*From:* Michael Robertson <mr () michaelrobertson com
<mailto:mr () michaelrobertson com>>
*Date:* April 22, 2017 at 12:53:43 PM EDT
*To:* David Farber <dave () farber net <mailto:dave () farber net>>
*Subject:* *Re: [IP] From a nyt and long time iper Re New York Times
defends hiring extreme climate denier: 'millions agree with him'*

Let the record show that some on this list would be branded as
"climate deniers" such as myself.

I'd point out that global warmers have largely abandoned that term
and adopted the amorphous semantic fraud which is "climate change".
They regularly promote outlandish climate hysteria in spite of the
fact that we now have decades of failed dire predictions.

And like the religions of the past, anyone who questions the logic is
ostracized as a heretic.

On Apr 22, 2017 8:42 AM, "Dave Farber" <farber () gmail com
<mailto:farber () gmail com>> wrote:




   Begin forwarded message:


   *From:* "Schwartz, John" <jswatz () nytimes com
   <mailto:jswatz () nytimes com>>
   *Date:* April 22, 2017 at 10:42:19 AM EDT
   *To:* dave () farber net <mailto:dave () farber net>
   *Subject:* *Re: [IP] Re New York Times defends hiring extreme
   climate denier: 'millions agree with him'*

   Dave,

       However you feel about the hiring of Bret Stephens, it's
   important to keep in mind that he has been hired as a single
   voice among the opinion columnists at the NYT. His hiring does
   not change the work being done in the newsroom, by reporters, to
   tell the story of climate change. Nor does it affect the stance
   of the editorial board, which has long aligned itself with the
   science and has consistently called for action to reduce
   greenhouse gas emissions.

        I'm a little self interested here, of course, in that I am
   one of about a dozen journalists at the NYT directly involved in
   reporting on climate change and the environment. The management
   of the newsroom has built up this climate team to bring these
   stories to the world. And we are--along with much of the rest of
   the newsroom--as you can see by following this link:

   https://www.nytimes.com/section/climate

         I'm not commenting on the Stephens hire. But many stories
   written about the decision to bring him into the stable of
   columnists suggest that it shows The New York Times is not
   serious about climate change.

         Nothing could be further from the truth.

         Best,

         John

   On Sat, Apr 22, 2017 at 7:46 AM, David Farber <farber () gmail com
   <mailto:farber () gmail com>> wrote:



       Begin forwarded message:

       *From: *Hasan Diwan <hasan.diwan () gmail com
       <mailto:hasan.diwan () gmail com>>
       *Subject: **Re: [IP] Re New York Times defends hiring
       extreme climate denier: 'millions agree with him'*
       *Date: *April 22, 2017 at 7:07:38 AM EDT
       *To: *"dave () farber net <mailto:dave () farber net>"
       <dave () farber net <mailto:dave () farber net>>

       Prof Farber,
       [for IP, should you deem fit]
       While I'm sure that one can persuade "millions" to say "I
       believe the climate is not changing", the more
       important/relevant question to ask is "Assuming the climate
       is changing, should humans do anything about it?" to which
       the answer that my old Biology professor liked to give was
       that life will find a way, but maybe without us. So, if one
       doesn't give a toss about one's own species, then sure, deny
       the need to do anything about climate change, as life will
       find a way to cope, but I, for one, want my descendants to
       be born and enjoy the same (or better) lifestyle than
       myself. Therefore, I'm firmly in the camp of "something
       needs to be done about the increased frequency of extreme
       weather on Earth".

       Also, let's be charitable and say that there are 1 and a
       half million climate change deniers on Earth, out of a total
       population of 7.5 billion is 2%, which is less than the
       margin of error in most of the polls that pass as facts in
       news broadcasts. -- H

       On 20 April 2017 at 17:18, Dave Farber <dave () farber net
       <mailto:dave () farber net>> wrote:


           ---------- Forwarded message ---------
           From: Rich Kulawiec <rsk () gsp org <mailto:rsk () gsp org>>
           Date: Thu, Apr 20, 2017 at 8:17 PM
           Subject: Re: [IP] New York Times defends hiring extreme
           climate denier: 'millions agree with him'
           To: Dave Farber <dave () farber net <mailto:dave () farber net>>


           (for IP, if you wish)

           This is not only incredibly tone-deaf, it's dangerous.
           I've been
           engaged in climatology self-education for the past 15
           years or so,
           attempting to leverage my science and engineering
           background into a
           basic understanding of the field via books, papers, IPCC
           reports, etc.

           I've lost count of the number of times a new paper or
           report shows that
           previous ones erred -- and those errors are almost
           invariably on the
           conservative side, i.e., newer work shows that the
           situation is worse
           than previously thought.  The emergence of positive
           feedback loops
           is particularly troubling; it seems like every few
           months another is
           uncovered and found to be contributing to the overall trend.

           The more I learn, the more horrified I become.

           Albert A. Bartlett wrote that the greatest shortcoming
           of the human race
           is man's inability to understand the exponential
           function.  We stand at
           an inflection point on a curve, staring at the slope
           rising in front of us,
           with limited time and resources to avoid the nearly
           inevitable...and the
           New York Times is pandering to the scientifically
           illiterate for the sake
           of some transient profits.  I would say that the
           judgment of history
           will be harsh -- but I fear that few will be left to
           write it.

           ---rsk




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   <http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/s/john_schwartz/index.html?8qa>

   The New York Times <http://www.nytimes.com/>

     <http://www.nytimes.com/>jswatz () nytimes com
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