Security Basics mailing list archives
Re: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator
From: "Craig, Tobin (OIG)" <tobin.craig () va gov>
Date: Sat, 11 Feb 2006 12:23:25 -0500
hopefully somebody on either side (or perhaps the court) is smart enough to explain that there is no difference between writing on a piece of paper and the big hunk of machinery in the corner of the courtroom with the blinking lights and beeping sounds (or all those contraband digital videos) in it, Hopefully someone IS smart enough to explain there is a WORLD of difference between a written document and a computer!! I'm not going to go into this any more other than to say that as a certified Questioned Document examiner AND as a certified Computer examiner, you have once more done nothing but demonstrate your own distorted bias. There is no point in me or anyone cautioning you about what you say in your emails, but I will caution those who have to read your postings. Just my opinion, nothing more, nothing less. Tobin -----Original Message----- From: Jason Coombs <jasonc () science org> To: Craig Wright <cwright () bdosyd com au> CC: dave kleiman <dave () davekleiman com>; security-basics () securityfocus com <security-basics () securityfocus com>; Robinson, Sonja <SRobinson () HIPUSA com> Sent: Thu Feb 09 15:07:23 2006 Subject: Re: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator Craig Wright wrote:
The comment "It is best practice to treat all cases as they may end up in litigation."
Importantly, there are no rules of evidence in civil litigation. The parties merely raise whatever objections they can think of to the legitimacy of the electronic discovery, and the court adjudicates each motion. There is no such thing as "electronic evidence" in civil court. Furthermore, rules of evidence apply only to law enforcement in criminal cases. A defendant could fabricate information that appears to clear her of any wrongdoing, and it could be admissable at trial. It would be up to law enforcement to find proof that the information is not evidence of innocence but is forged. This is where the 'questioned documents' field of forensics enters the picture. Anything that a non-law enforcement investigator finds that may be valuable for either the prosecution or the defense simply enters the fray. Arguments are made before the court, and the whole process moves forward. Only under extraordinary circumstances would a third-party computer investigator who botches the 'forensic controls' and 'proper procedure' cause 'evidence' to be excluded. The jury will ultimately give the 'evidence' whatever weight they decide to give it, and hopefully somebody on either side (or perhaps the court) is smart enough to explain that there is no difference between writing on a piece of paper and the big hunk of machinery in the corner of the courtroom with the blinking lights and beeping sounds (or all those contraband digital videos) in it, that the machine simply holds documents and the jury must decide if the defendant authored those documents or placed them in storage as possessions. Claiming that electronic investigations always produces "digital evidence" and therefore must always employ "forensics" in order to discover them is nonsense. Regards, Jason Coombs jasonc () science org --------------------------------------------------------------------------- EARN A MASTER OF SCIENCE IN INFORMATION ASSURANCE - ONLINE The Norwich University program offers unparalleled Infosec management education and the case study affords you unmatched consulting experience. Tailor your education to your own professional goals with degree customizations including Emergency Management, Business Continuity Planning, Computer Emergency Response Teams, and Digital Investigations. http://www.msia.norwich.edu/secfocus --------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------------------------------- EARN A MASTER OF SCIENCE IN INFORMATION ASSURANCE - ONLINE The Norwich University program offers unparalleled Infosec management education and the case study affords you unmatched consulting experience. Tailor your education to your own professional goals with degree customizations including Emergency Management, Business Continuity Planning, Computer Emergency Response Teams, and Digital Investigations. http://www.msia.norwich.edu/secfocus ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Current thread:
- RE: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator, (continued)
- RE: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator Craig Wright (Feb 08)
- Re: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator Jason Coombs (Feb 09)
- RE: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator dave kleiman (Feb 09)
- RE: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator Craig Wright (Feb 09)
- Re: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator Jason Coombs (Feb 10)
- RE: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator Craig Wright (Feb 09)
- RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator evb (Feb 10)
- Re: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator Bob Radvanovsky (Feb 09)
- Re: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator Jason Coombs (Feb 09)
- RE: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator Craig Wright (Feb 10)
- Re: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator Craig, Tobin (OIG) (Feb 13)
- RE: Spam: RE: Forensic/Cyber Crime Investigator Craig Wright (Feb 08)